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PL 12/17/1975 - 31192r�.�"�'" � � � �"1 �, CITY OF FRIDLEY PLANI�ING COMMISSION MEETING CALL 10 ORDER: DECEMBER 17, 1975 Chairman Harris called the meeting to order at 7:35 P.M. ROLL CALL: Members Present: Membet°s Absent: Others Present: PAGE 1 Har•ris, Bergman, Drigans, Langenfeld, Peterson Scott � Barbara Shea, Vice Chairperson of Human Resources Commission Jerrold Boardman, City Plann�r and 4 representatives of S.A.C.A.: �Grace Lynch, Human Resources Commission member Kay Poppoff, 10325 Xeon Street N.W. P1ary Zagaros, Anoka County Community Action �'rogram Joan Staupe, 6332 Boone Avenue North APPRQVE PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES: DECEMBER 3, 1975 Mr. Harris said that on page 9 of the minui:es, Mr. Scot�c said that Mr. Merre1l w�s close to having a recommendation for denial, so he should be happ,y thaL it went the way �it did ins�ead of himself. Mr. Langenfeld said that an �he top ai page 20, it should be goals and objectives, instead of goals and a�jections...o MOTION by Peterson, seconded by Langenfeld� tliat the Plannin_q Commission approv� thezr minut�s of Dece�er 3, 1975 as corrected. Upan a voice vote, a11 va�inq aye, the motion carried unanimous.Zy. RECEIVE PARKS & RECREATION COMMISSION MINUTES: (�OVEMEER 2�. 1975 MOTION by Langenfeld, seconded by Peterson, that the Pl.anning Commission receive the Parks � Recreation Commission minutes of the November 24, 1975 meeting. Upon a voice vote, a11 voting �ye, �he motion carri�d unanimously. RECCIVE COMMUNITY UEVELOP(�ENT COP1MISSION_NfINUTES: DECEh9�ER 2, 1975 ' MOTION by Bergman, seconded by Peterson, that the Planning Commission receive the minutes of th� Community Development Corr��ission m�eting ef Decent�er 2, 197_5. Mr. tangen-Feld asked why they had a presentation on �taxation and assessmer.�; procedures? Mr. �ez�gman said this had come from a Community Development base of making Frid7ey the most desirable residential area in the metropolitan area. Gde �hen got or� the sub�ect o�F residential improvemeni;s and it was pointed out �h�t �:N�e �ax �truc (;ure tended 40. di scourage these h�me improver,�ents becau�e thi s raised the tax basa_ un your residential property. This discussion lead to the opinion tha.t rath�r than penalizing a property owner for making improvements, he shauld k�� g�ven a tax break, if we want to promote this improvemen� progr•am. ��e said Lhat as tne;� could read from the minutes, it was pointed out to us that �he �ax i ativs a►,e establ i shed by the State, anci t�er•efore ti�ere t�ras nothi ng tha � r�idi�y could do in �egard t� the tax laws, that would be different from what any otl��r• C;ty co��ld do, s� our suggestion was not feasible. Mr. Madsen pointed ou�t Planning Commission Meeting - December 17, 1975 Page 2 that citizens had a waefully magnified idea of how much his taxes would increase from an improvement, and it was not all that bad. The increases are low. . ��`. Mr. Langenfeld asked Mr. Boardman to explain his statement made in these � minutes on 3.2 beer and zoning restrictions. Mr. Boardman said that 3.2. beer licenses cannot be restricted because of zoning. He said the only control we had was that if they opened up a bar or a tavern, but there was nothing in the ordinance that said you couldn't have a beer license in other•zoning districts if it was the secondary use of the property. He said that bars and taverns were only allowed in C-2 zoning. He said the lack of controls in the beer ordinance was one of the reasons the City Council asked the Planning Commission to study this ordinance. UPON a voice vote, a11 voting aye, the motion carried unanimous.Iy. RECEIVE APPEALS COMMISSION MINUTES: DECEMBER 9, 1975 MOTION by Drigans, seconded by Peterson, that the Planning Commission receive the minutes of the Appeals Commission meeting of December 9, 1975. Upon a voice vote, a1l voting aye, the motion carried unanimously. RECEIVE MEMO TO THE FRIDLEY CITY COUNCIL FROM BILL NEE ON VARIANCE PROCEDURES, __._ . DATED DECEMBER 11, 1975 . - • MOTION by Drigans, seconded by Langenfeld, that the Planning Commission ' receive a copy of a memo to the City Council from Bill Nee dated December 11, 1975. �1 _,,..,:r__ Mr. Drigans said that Mayor Nee's remarks were very well taken, and he was sure that.the Appeals CorrJnission would consider everything in this memo in o�ar consideration of variances and will not take our additional responsibilities lightly. ' UPDIV a voice vote, a11 voting aye, the motion carried unanimously. RECEIVE HUMAN RESOURCES COMMISSION MINUTES: DECEMBER 4, 1975 MOTIOlJ by Shea, seconded by Peterson, that the Planning Commission receive the Human Resources minutes of their December 4� 1975 meeting. Mrs. Shea said the Human Resources Commission had made a motion at their meeting to recognize the S.A.C.A. organization and endorse their principles and further recommended that �he City or Fridley allocate a fair share sum of $500 for the express purpose of developing an Information and Referral Service. - She said that Grace Lynch, a member ofr the Human Resources Commission and three representatives of S.A.C.A. were in the audience and would like to explain what � S.A.C.A. was all about. MOT_TON by Peterson, sPCOnded by Langenfeld, that the Planning Commission open an informal public hearing tor a request by S.A,C.A. for a$500 donation from the City of Fridley. Upon a voice vote, a11 voting aye, Chairman Harris declared the informal public hearing open at 8:15 P.M. � � Grace Lynch sai� tha� the Southern Anoka County Association was developed by concerned citizens and community representatives from the cities of Fridley, -���.� i Planning Commission Meeting - December 17, 1975 � Page 3 Spring Lake Park and Columbia Heights. They started meeting a little over a year ago to discuss and determine the emergency assistance needs for residents E-1� in the southern part of Anoka County. These communities border each other and have a combined population of 64,564. An attempt to organize was made for the � following reasons: (1) There was no information and referral system serving this population center, (2) A few individual churches were operating very limited emergency assistance programs. They consisted of pantry shelves and an emergency loan fund. The problem was twofold. The services were both insuf- � � ficient and inadequate. (3) The growing ecanomic problems of inflated prices and high unemployment have forced more people into lower income brackets. The current unemployment rate in Anoka County is 9 to 10 percent according to the Minnesota State Unemploymen� Office, and (4) Area resources had never been mobilized to serve these community needs. These resources included money, materials, and manpower. She continued that when S.A.C�A. was organized, their objective was to provide food, clothing, transportation, shelter, medical needs, i and other necessiti�s to recipients in the southern part of Anoka County on an emergency and temporary basis as provided by the Board of Directors or their ' appoin�tees. Furthermore, to serve as an information and referral cen':�r between the persons and families in need, and individuals, community organizations or soc�al agencies that can best fill and/or meet those needs; to provide professional advice through resource volunteers, diagnose problems, and act immediately on survival needs, �o provide short term casework service, liason be�ween clients and other agencies; to motivate clients, to seek services through referrals; to render human care services through volunteerism, to motivate communi�y groups and individuals to give of their time and experience; to fill the gap between the onset of problems and the agency and/or group best equipped to handle the � problems(s), to increase the quantity and quality of needed human care services � �hrough�volunteerism extended to service to individuals in need of services, and the goa7s were to provide on an emergency and temporary basis, tangible goods, shelter, financial aid, and other necessities to clients in need. To provide shor� term casework service. To act as an information and re�erral service. To involve volunteers directly in human services, to involve commui�ity groups and individuals in donating goods, monies, and services for those determined to be in need. To remain loosely structured in order to be free to meet needs as they arise. Ms. Lynch said that they were appearing before the Planning Commission - for a recommendation that the City of Fridley donate $500 toward the information and referral service only. She said the budget for this service was $1500 and they would apply to Columbia Heights and Spring Lake Park for a$500'donation also. She said the items that made up this budget were $36.00 for the installation of the phone, $597.00 for phone service for one year, cost of the phone after oifice hours which was $512.00 which included $354.00 for live answering service f��^ ar�e year and $158.00 for a metef�ed line to answering service switchboard far one year, and $356.00 in costs of assembling the system and files. This $1500 a,�as a one year budget. Mr. Bergman asked if this was a profit making o�,ganizatio�? Grace Lynch said it was not, it was a private non-profit organization. Joan S�aupe said that many churches in the area make donatians in some form to S.A.C.A. ^� Mrs. Staupe said they had used several numbers where members of S:A.C.A. �- could be reached in prep�ring food and toys for needy families for Christmas, but . they were hoping to have just une number to ca11 a�ter the lst of Ja�uaa,y. Mr. Rergman asked if they had ar�y record of how many calls they had received for this �-- .,, Plannin Commission h1�,eting - December 17, 1975 Page 4 project. Kay Poppofg said she had received 164 emergency calls at the Blaine number. Mr. Peterson asked if it would be volunteers or trained people who would be handling the information and referral service. Kay Poppoff said they would be trained volunteers. Mr. Drigans said this would be a referral service and not a counseling service. Grace Lynch said they would hope to give them the information so they could help themselves. Kay Poppoff said �hat in a case when the gas has been shut off because of non-payment, same�times a direct call from a S.A.C.A. volunteer would facilitate the gas being turned on sooner and they would be able to furnish food and clothing in emergency situations. ,�� �y� Mary Zagaros said they vrere vrorking on their Christmas program now and � so far they had 125 families in need of food and other emergency help. She ' said that she got from 3 to 5 calls a day asking for emergency food and clothing, help wi�h financial problems, legal problems, etc. She said �hat at the present �ime they were working through the churches and service organizations but in or�"er to coordinate their ef��orts, they should have one central number where•people could call. She said that in the present economic situation, there are more and more people who need help. Mr. Boardman asked how long S.A.C.A had been formed? Mrs. Staupe said it 'was incorpo�ated 3ust last year. Mr. Boardman asked how.this fit into the _... Cou�ty Welfare Program and asked if they were duplicating any o�F their services? ' He said the Human Resources Commission had a CETA employee who was working on � coordinating all the services offered in �he Couniy so ihere would not be a dup1ication of services, and so far he did not think the Human Resources Commiss;on had go�ten that report back, at least he hadn't seen it. He said �'1 that S.A.C.A. may be offering the type of information and referral service the City should have.� but he would like to see the report from the CETA person before he would be willing to make any staff recommendation on this request. Grace Lynch said that S.A.C.A. would be helping out in a temporary situation, and if someone need long range help, t{�aac would be referred to the Anoka County Welfare Department, or anywhere else where they could get long range help. Mrs. Shea said that the CETA person was working with the S:A.C.A. peop7e on the information and referral service. �his was why the Human Resources Commis- sion made the recommendation �that the City of Fridley donate $500 towards this servyce. Mr. Drigans asked if this information and referral service would be patterned after a similar system and if they would have guidelines? Joan Staupe said that most referral services were by area, so there were other such services in the metropolitan area. She sa�d the closer the information and referral service was to the people it was meant to serve, the more effective it was. Mr. Harris.asked if this was going to be a yearly request, or just a one time request. Grace Lynch said this was for a one year budget, but they were hoping that in time this would be a self-sustaining project. She said that after they had been organized longer 1;hey hoped to get help from United Fund. Mr. Boardman said that he �.hought an information and referral system was �, an important part in providinc� resou��ce needs to our citizens. He said the _' one's who would benefit from this service would be the residents of Fridley. He said that he thought it should be kept in mind that this would be one group .� Planning Commission Meeting - December 17, 1975 � �aqe 5� of citizens helping another group of citizens. �� Mr. Qoardman said he thought the CETA report should be ready by April or May, and he would like to wait until that time before he made a recommendation for S.A.C.A. Ne didn't know how c'riiical this request was. Mrs. Shea asked if they had approached Spring Lake Park�and Columbia Heights with this proposal? Grace Lynch said this was the first City they had approached, but they would be.making requests of the other two communities very soon. � Chairman Harris asked how soon they would need a determination on this request. �race Lynch said they would like one made at this meeting. Mr. Drigans said the Planning Commission was only a recommending body, so he was sure that this presentation would have to be made again before the City Council. Mr. Bergman said that in listening to the discussion, he got the impression that the Human Resources Corunission had not finished their job yet, and thererore, this request �o support S.A.C.A was not timely. Can anyone clarify this. Mrs. Shea said that at the time the Human Resources Commission made this � a project, they were not aware of the S.A.C.A, organization. �r. Boardman ' said that S.A.C.A had been organized about a year, and the CETA employee go� involved with this at a later point in time. She is supposed to be checking � with this group, Anol:a County, Fridley, Blaine, the Red Cross, and other __, organizations to see how much �uplication of services there are. When her report is completed, it should show us the best way to go to have this infarmation and referral service, which is a needed service in this area. Joan Stau�e said this was why one coordinated referral service was needed. I� was very difficult to get the information to the people without one single number to call. Mr. Peterson said he understood that this was a non-profit organiza�ion, that was not vrelfare and not under any governmental agency. He said they were an action group9 but all they were r•equesting funds for at this meeting was for the information and referral service part of this organization. Mr. Drigans asked if there was anyway that this could be a County�wide program, funded by the Coun�y? Mary Zagaros said there was no money available at the Coun�ty� for this typ� of project. Mr. Drigans asked Chairman Narris where th� City got the funds for this type of a proposal. Mr. Flarris said it wo��'(d have to come out uf the General Fund: Mr. Drigans then asked if the Coun�ty didn't have a general fund? Grace Lynch said that because they were a beginniny organization, there was no �vay they were going to get funding from the Coun�tye � Once, they were established, they probably could get some County funaing. She said this organization �4as still in the forming stage, and they needed help to get organized. ^_ M�^. Drigans said we had two County Commissioner's, one in Columbia Heigt�ts, � and one in Fr�dley, and he thc�ught th�re should be some pressure brought to ,�..- bear on i;hem for fiunding from the County. Mr. Harris asked them if the�� had applied to �he Coun�y a� all �or �unding? Grace Lynch said no. Plannin Commission Meeting - December 17, 1975 Page 6 � Chairman Harris asked if the representatives of .S.A.C.A. would like to � make any other statements before the informal Public Hearing was closed. Joan Staupe said �hey would appreciate the Planning Commission's support and wanied to assure them that they would be asking for this support from Columbia Heights and Spring Lake Park. . Mr. Boardman said he would advise them to contact the County Commissioner's. MOTION by Peterson, seconded by Bergman, that the Planning Commission close the infoz�aal Public Hearing on the�rPquest for $500 by S.A.C.A. for an information and referral service. Upon a voice vote, all voting aye, Chairman Harris declared the informal Public Hearing closed at 9:10 P.M. � UPON A VOICE VOTE, to�receive the �uman Resources Commzssion minutes, a11 voting aye, the motion carried unanimously. MOTION by Shea, seconded by Langenfeld, to recognize the S.A.C.A. organization and endorse their principles and further recorrmtend the City of Fridley allocate a fair share sum of $500 for the express purpose of developing an Information and Referral Service. Mr. Bergman said tha� having an information and referral service was.a.good idea and would be a benefit to the general citizenry, and therefore ought logically be supported by taxpayer's funding. He said the four ladies at this meeting were spending their time at �his meeting with no financial gain, and no in.tent for �-� financia] gain, and have spent a lot oir time�on�this program and evidently will continue to do so, and he thought they should be commended for this. He said his only concern was that in supporting and funding this information and refierral service that- we do attend to the question of duplication of services, and that this be adequately reviewed, so that the service we were recommending be in control of this service, rather than a duplication and a cause for confusion. Mr. Langenfeld said that he was in agreement wi�h the concept of neighbors helping neighbors. He said he questioned why the National Jaycees had turned down their request for funding. Joan Staupe said they had 280 requests for fiunding, and they could only fund about 86, so they just did not have the funds. Mr. Langenfeld said he knew that money was expended for less needy purposes than this, but he �vould like to hear what the County Commissioner had to say about this to see i� the County would participate in �his project, and if they won't then they could come to the City. Mr. Drigans said he agreed witf� Mr. Langenreld. He said that ore of the concerns he had was that this was the first step in rather a large program. He said that he knew this would be a benefit to the community, however, the $500 requested was for a one year budget, and where will these funds come from next year? Ne said that if they couldn't get financial help from the County, then Frid1ey, Columbia Heights, and Spring Lake Park might be committing themselves for more than one year. He said he felt this was a worthy program, but what were the long range plans and the long range goals. If the County won't make a commitment now, will they ever make a commitment? He said we are the first ,--� City being contacted for a commitment, and he would see no reason why we couldn'� give.them funds, but would �his be a yearly commitment? Mrs. Shea said S.A.C.A: had approached churches and c��v�c org�nizations for help with their other progranis, i t was j ust as ki ng for hel p�.. '`'�a the i n Fo��nati on and referral servi ce from the City. Planning Commission Meetinq - December 17, 1975 Pa9e 7 Mr. Peterson sai.d that he didn't know that much about S.A.C.A, and ,.� even after an hour's presentation he wasn't prepared to make a recommendation on this organizatian. He said he would like to check with his church to�see if they have worked with this organization and see what they say about it. He thought that sometimes they needed more information before they recommended that the City fund these different groups. He said it appeared that this would be quite a substantial program in years to come. • � r"��_ '- Chairman Harris said he could agree with some points made by everyone on the Commission. He said he thought this was a good idea and was probably a needed service'for the community. He didn't feel it was the primary responsibility of the City of Fridley to provide funding for this service forever and ever. He said he could vote for this on a one year basis, but next year he thought someone else should be participating. He thought they asked the taxpayers of the City of Fridley to carry enough burdens. He said he thought the Anoka County Board should be participating,.and as they mentioned, that after they had been�organized longer, they could possibly get �nited Fund support. UPON A ro11 ca11 vote, Shea and Harris voting aye, Bergman and Drigans voting nay, and Peterson and Langenfeld abstazning, the motion failed f�r lack of a majority vote. MOTION by Drigans, seconded by Petersan, that the Planning Commzssion recomr.lend to Council tha.t they contact the Board of County Commissioner`s with the recommendation that the County look into the feasibility of funding the S.A.C.A. program and the information and referral service i� Anoka County. U�on. a voice vote, Bergman, Harris, Petersan, Drigans, Langenfeld voting aye, Shea abstaining, the motion carried. EIVE COPY OF CITY ULATIONS OF THE M FRIDLEY'S RECOMMENDATION ON THE PROPOSED RULES AND MOTIDN by Peterson, seconded by Bergman, that ihe Planning Commission receive a copy of the City of Fridley's recommendation on the proposed rules and reg�la- tions of the Minnesota Environmental Quality Council. Upon a voice vote, a11 voting aye, the motion carried unanimously. Mr. Bergman said he had been upset during the discussion on the proposed rules and regulations of the Minnesota Enviranmental Quality Council because of the completely negative discu�sion by all parties. He said �he reason it upset�him was because we all have sa� back and complained asking why someone did�'t do something about the ruination of our natural resources and the dispoiling of our waters, etc., and here was an effor°t to do some�hing, and all he heard were negative commen�ts. He said he even asked the question if anyone thought the intent af this law was good, and no one wauld respond. Mr. Peterson said he,probably was negative because he felt that government did not necessarily have the expertise to say what was best for Fridley. Mr. Langenfeld said the nature of the recommendation on ihe proposed rules and regulations tends to make it less negative. He said that he thought one of the big points of this recommendation was the inclusion:.of enviror.mental planning. Ne said that if tha� was done, it would eliminate a lot of negative feelings. Mr. Langenfelcl said t�e was pleased �'vith the recommendations as wr�t��en by Mr. �oardman, and he was especially pleased with item 12. He said there were Planning Commission Meetin - Decem�Er 17, 1975 Page 8 other good points�, but he wanted to emphasize that item. Mr. Bergman said he would like to commend Mr. Boardman on the quality ��- of his report to the State. Mr. Harris asked how this recommendation was given to the State? Mr. Boardman said he took it to them personally, Mr. �, Narris said it was almost to the point where he would like to see them sign a receipt for it, to make sure that they got it. Mr. Drigans said he would like to agree of the report to the State, and he said that quite strongly where we were getting such a on these proposals, and he thought this was with Mr. Bergman on the quality item 15 reflected his sentiments short time period from the State very well stated in the report. Upon a voice vote, aI1 votinq aye, the motion carried unanimously. CONTINUED: REVIEW GOALS AND OBJECTIVES OF THE PARKS & RECREATION COMMISSION Mr. Pe{erson said that when they first starting working on these goals and ob�ectives we probably were looking at specific goals to provide this or that or programs. As we discussed this, the Commission began to feel that they were responsible for facilities rather than programs. He said the Park goals and objectives were rather self explanatory, as far as what we were trying to do. He said the Recreation goal was�to provide for and encourage the advancement of recreational opportunities for all residents. They felt they should just provide space manag�ment to facilitate the implementation of recreation activies. He said the soccer program and horse..shoe programs had been established this way. t Mr. Bergman asked if there was any system that the Parks & Recreation Commission had to stay in touch with usage of the existing parks? Mr. Peterson said they do attempt to do this, but it was rather difficult. He said that they did have the Park Ranger and the�Police Department keep a tabulation of, the number of cars at Locke Fark and where they came from. He said they had a talley of the number of chil�ren in the parks programs. He said they got figures from all the Associations. We also get some imput from the staff, and we do visit the parks to look at the equipment to see how it was being maintained, or if we need more equipment, etc. He asked if this answered Mr. Bergman's question. � Mr. Bergman said he didn't see it in the goals and objectives that there be a need to be attentive to the usage or a change in usage to assure wise spending of the taxpayer's dollars. He said he was speaking of efficiency, effe.ctiveness, conservativeness, so that tax dollars were well spent. Mr. Peterson said �he second objective under goal one which was to establish a park system that is flexible and can be changed t� mee� public needs would take ca�e of this. He said that goal 2 was to pf�omote 'peop7 e oriented" park development, was an attempt to be sensitive to the changing needs. He said they were making an attempt to be.more people oriented than program oriented. Mr. Boardman said an attempt would be made to get neighborhoods involved in their own space. He said the more involved they tivere, the more the park would be used. He said the fourth goal was to provide for functional and aesthetical consideration in thedevelopment of a park facility, keeping in mind both dolla•r^ and human value aspects of design and necessary balance. You can't go strictl�� by dollar value alone, you have to take into consideration if the dollars spent are worth while in the actual human aspect that you get, out of it. He said that Planning Coirmission Meeting - December 17, 1975 Page 9 in attending some of the Parks & Recreation Commission meetings he had noted � ��'�`1 that they were very consider�te of this type of thing. , Mr. Drigans said there were six park goals with about eleven objectives, . ar�d only one recreation gaal and objective. He felt this was kind of lop-sided. Mr. Peterson said he thougf�t tr�ey were being more peopl� oriented by daing it this way. He said that rather than saddling themselves with for instance, ttiat�the� were going to maintain a Fridley football program, as a cooperative effort, we thought we would rather have as an objective to provide space management for the implementation of that program, or whatever type of program �hat people might wan�. He said that if interest in a y�uth football program should wane, that this be allowed to fade away without being an objective ofi the Parks & Recreation Commission �o keep it going. That v�as why we wrote our goals and objectives h?avy on the facility side and heavy on communi-ty involvemenz side, and less specifically program oriented. It allows us to serve a changing population �as the citizens demand programs. Mr. Grigans said that physical fitness h�d been a national goal. He said this was for all people, regardless of age o whether they were sport oriented or not. He thought this should have been mentioned in these goals and obj�ctives. He thought �his would be a good goal for the City to ad�iere to. Mr. Peterson said he would have no objection to this be�ng a goa7 wher� the Rlanning Commission set up their goals and objectives. . n Mr. Peterson said that wi�h the type of budge� the Par._ks� and Recreation De�artment. operated un�er, the mul�itudes of uses that the parks wei°e put ta, and the diverse programs that our citizens want, �hey didn't �eel �that a program � would be a benefit unless there was a spirit in it by interested people �in that program. • Mr. Soardman said the main thing that 'che Farks & Recreation Commission was trying to evolve was that �he City of Fridley should not be in the job of sponsoring or providing a recreation activitys bu� what they should be doing was encouraaing recrea�tional activity through th� use and utilization of management of recreation facilities. The encouragement and promotion o�F recreation- al activities should come under space management of the facilities. Mr. Drigans said he didn't agree with Mr. Boardman. We have a Park Department that manages the facilities. We have a Park & Recreation Commissian that encompas- ses, not only the recommendation to manage those facilities, but to create a managed program for the citizens. Mr. Boardman said the City could not afrord to maintain ��ull fledged progran�s. Ne said to hire coaches and umpires and to completely manac�e a pr•ogram was too cost prohibitive. Mr. PEterson said �ha� in the case of the City baseball program, if: had cost them $12,000 to have a baseball program for 200 boys. He said �hat �ihe Babe Ruth and Lit-tle League have run a program for 750 boys for $8,000. That was the difference between a City progr°am and a private program. {-le said trie private programs can get volun�eers for coaching and umpiring. He said we provided the iacilities for the volunteer programs, but it was much less costly �o the City. �- Mr. Peterson said they did have more recreation goals, but as they debated _ 1� them, they decided to leave specific programs aut of the recreation goals so they cou1d ren�ain more flexible. We fel� that by mentioning specific programs, we were telling the citizenry vdhat they war�ted, ahd we would rather be in ...�.�,-..,,�1':a-s Planning Commission Meeting - December 17, 1975 Paqe 10 take the position of providing the space for programs as they were developed _� by interested citizenry. Mr. Drigans said he accepted Mr. Peterson's argumen�, he just felt that the influence of the staff in the Parks & Recreation Department has influenced their goals and objectives so that they are one-sided. He said thati if there had been 100 volunteers in the audience when they worked on these goals and objectives, they would have had a better balance. Mr. Drigans said he thought that if they had a copy of the goals of physical fitness, these could have been adopted into the recreation goals. Mr. Peterson asked Mr. Boardman if he would try and get a copy of those physical fitness goa]s. Mr. Boardman said he would try to get �hem. Mr. Harris asked Mr. Peterson if they had considered putting into their goals and objectives equal opportunity for those people who do not participate in specific programs. F12 said his childr-�� were girls and in the swing and slide group. He wondered where they a�ould fit into these goals and objectives. Mr. Drigans said that for years he has been trying to get wading pools in the tot lots. He said Columbia Heights had them, but we couldn't seen to get them in Fri�ley. Mr. Peterson said that children in his neighborhood had enjoyed a vacant lot for years before it was develop�d. They built tunnels and tree houses and rode their bikes over mounds of dirto He said tf�y. had even discussed : having_ an area like this in their parks where kids could just dig and play as they did in vacant lots. Mr. Bergman said there was no wa thaL �he could �' Y y provide something for _ everyone. Ne said you can think of a neighborhood with t��o swing age children �Aai�st a neighborhood that had twenty-five. The 25 would get s�ings and the 2 wouldn't. Mr. Peterson said that in that case it would be a matter of dollars. Mr. Boardman said that tivith these goals and objectives they weren't trying to dictate, they were trying to allow. People in the neighborhoods should decide what facilities they want in their parks. . P9r. Harris asked if they made any attemp� to define recreation. Mr. Peterson said they felt in was any activity that heiped to recreate yourself. Mr. Bergman said he had heard it defined as something you really want to do without extern�l pressures. Mr. Drigans said h� thought this plan cover�d facilities quite well. Chairman Harris declared a recess at 10:30 P.M, and called the Planning Co�nission meeting back to order at 10:50 P.M. SET UP TIMETABLE FOR STUDY ON THE PROPOSED CQM�kEHEPdSiUE HUUSING PLAN Mr. Boardman said he had given the Planning Comn�ission a proposed timetable �for the comprehensive housing plan, and at the same time.,work.on an application for a C�mmunity Development 61oc�C Grant, and at the same time try to get some goals and objectives laid out: Tn a Hud block grant fund, one of �he requirements �vas �hat you have a 5-year housing assis�tance plan. This was what we were developing in �he comprehensive housing plan. He said the deadlines for applying for this . fuiid wef°e between February lst and March 15th, 1976. If we miss that deadline,�� �hey we have lost out on the funding for this year, an� this is the secand year '� � of ti�e funding now. He said they �F�lt �nat in order to make good use of �:he funding, they would like to get 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5tHi year i�uiidiny. We havz to Planning Cor�niss�on Meeting - December 17, 1975 Page 11 try and get thraugh the comprehensive ��ousing plan in order to meet the.deadline. This housing plan has been set up on the Planning �ommission goals and objectives ��-� which have ►�ot been se-t up yet. �1 Mr. Boardman said he ha� set a tentative deadline that the City Council hold the public hearir�g on tfze r_omprehensive hausing plan and the HUD block grant application on Fek�r!aary 9, 1976. Mr. Harris said he didn'�; Icnow if they could meet that deadline. Mr. Boardman said this wou1d require a Planning Eommission public hearing on the 21st of January. Mro Boarc{man said the next draft would be more complete tha the first draft tMey r�eceived and it would ir�clude all the maps and background data. Mr. Harris said th e.ir first meeting in January would be the 7th9 so they would only have one meei.ing before the Public Hearing, Mr. Boardman said they had set u� Plai�nirig Commission meetings on the 21st and 28th of January, and they would have a meetirtg on February 4th before this went to the Gity Cauncii fc�r their• publiG hearing. He said that i�= the Planning Commission would read this plan through before their meeiing of January 7th this would save a lot of time. He would try to set up the member Commission meetings so that �hey could get their inpu�t to the Planning Commission. � Mr. Bergman asked if he unders�ood correctly that this plan was supposed to be based on published goals and objec�ives? If so, we had better put our �hrust on that. Mr. 6oardman said they were basing this on some goals and obj�ctives of the member Commissian's a�t the present �ime. � C�air��nan Harris said it would be great to meet the timetable as �, Mr. Boardman had described, but he didn'1; kr�ow if they could make it. All i ichey could do was tryo Mr. Boardman said he kne�v it t�as a�ough schedule. He said it would require each Commission member to do some homework. They would iiave to read all the data b�fore �he meeting, and this would facilitate their review. Mr. Qaardman said he thought he would s�� up a tentative timetable, and if the rev�iew of the comprehensive housing plan couldn't be completed by the deadline, then they would have to make a HUD block grant-�und application next year instead of this year. Chairman Harris said they would try to work wi�hin the timetable, but if ii couldr�'t be done, it wouldn'� be done. Mr. Drigans asked Mr. Boardman if he could qive some idea.of how much time it wouid �ake to review this plan on�an individual. basis. Mr. Boardman said he thought it would take about 10 hours. NE4J APPOINTMENTS TO P1EhiBER CCMMISSIONS Mr. Beryman said that one member of their Commission (Community Developmen�) ' had only attended one m�eti�g. She has said that she wouldn't be coming to any mor°e meetings, but she has��'t sent in a resignation. He said he would like to request �the City Council �o appoint someone to take Mrs. Stanley's place. The Community Development Commission had quite a lot to do on this Commission a�t this ��: time, ancl it was hard bei9�g one member shor�c. , � s r Ghair+�nan Harris said he wouid ur�� the City Council to appoint a new member ta the Community Develapment Commission in all dtae haste. ,�'" . -P �.� .:- _ ;:'� , Planning Commission Meeting - December 17, 1975 � Page 12 ADJOURNMENT: i� � MOTION by Drigans, seconded by Langenfeld, that the meeting be adjournec.Z�. ' Upon a voice vote, a1I voting aye, Ch�irman Narris declared the P.Zanning Commissio;. meeting of December 17, 1975 adjourned at 11:40 P.M. 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