PL 01/10/1979 - 30502� �
CITY OF FRIDLE`l
PJ�ANi�TING COPM�IISSION MEFTINC, JANUAFiY ].0, 1979
Ms. Schnabel 3u�gested that because Chairman Aarris was absent, and Vice Chairman
'�� Langenfeld �ias due to arrive late� tliey appoint a temparary actin� chairman until
Vice Chairman Langenfeld arrived� and sh� made the followin� moti�:
MOTION by Ms. Schnabel, seconded by Mr. Storla� to appoint Mro Peterson as temporary
action chairman until Vice Chairman Langenfeld arrived.
UPON A VOICE VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE, THE MOTIOIV WAS C.ARRIED UNANIMOUSLY.
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CALL TO ORDER:
Acting Chairman Peterson called t�e January 10� 1979, meet3.ng of the Planning Coa�ni.ssion
to order at 7:35 P•�•
ROLL CALL:
,. I+�embers Present: Ned Stor].e�� LeRoy Oquist� Virginia Schnabel' Robert Peterson
Members Absent: R3.chard Harris� Jim Langenfeld (Mr. Langenfeld arrived at 8:20 P.M.)
Others Present: Jerry Boardman� City Planner
� l. APPROVE AGEPTDA FOR PLANNTNG COI�i�IISSION MEETI�TG: JANUARY 10� �979:
MOTION by Ms. Schnabel, seconded by Mr. Oquist to adopt the a�genda as presented.
Mr. Storla stated that Item No. 9 on the agenda� the I�iemor�ndum of Agreement� had
been tabled and should not appear on the agenda unt31 it 3s removed from th� table.
UPON A VOTCE VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE� ACTING CHAIRMAN PETERSON DEC�.�ARED TAE AGENDA ADOP1.'ED
WITH THE CORRECTION.
2. APPROVE Ti� PLAlV1VING COMNlISSION MINUT�S: DECEMBER 6y 1978:
MOTION by Mr. Oquist, seconded by Ms. Schnabel to approve the December 6� 1978 Planning
Coaanission Minutes.
Ms. Schnabel stated that on page 6, fourth paragraph, second sentence� there should be
a correc�Cion. That sentence should read: as recommended by Appeals, instead of as
recommended by Planning.
UPON A VOICE VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE� ACTING CHAIRMAN PETE�RSON DECLARED THE MINt1TES
APPROVID WITH THE CORRECTION.
3. PUBLIC HEARIPIG: CONSIDERATION OF A PROPOSED PRELIMINARY PLAT P.S.
INNSBRUCK NOF2'H TOWNHOUSE PLAT 5. AiVD A TOWNHOUSE DEVELOPMENT. T-,
OAKS, BY D.;RiZEL A. FARR DEVELOPhI�NT CORPORATION; Being a replat oi Outlo�t H'
Innsbruck North, excegt that part already platted as Inrisbruck North Townhouse
�� Plat �+� and part� of Innsbruck North Second and Third Additions' generally located
North of I.694, b�tween rieister Road and the Corporate Limits of the City of
Fridley.
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PLANNING CONA4TSSION t�TING JANUARY I0, 1979 __ PAGE 2
M4TION by Mr. Oquist� seconded by Mr. Storla, to open the public hearing. I
UPON A VOICE VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE� ACTING CAAIRMAN PETERSON DECL�tED THE PUBLIC �
HEARING OPEN AT 7:�+5 P.M• �'
Mr. Boardman noted that the Public Hearing was opened for two items� the plat, and
the to�*nhouses. Mr. Boardman stated that page 1$ of the agenda book shows Outlot H.
This is the 5th and final plat in the City of Fridley for the Innsbruck Townhouse area.
It is l.ocated ir� the southeast section of the Darrel Farr plat area and is the last
section of the Innsbruck area to be platted. Mr. Boardma.n sho�wed the Commnissioners the
plans of how the area would be platted out. Mr. Boardman stated that the initial design
was for an ei�ht unit structL:re, but had been chan�ed to a six unit structure� and also
changed it into a townhouse, where before they were considerin� a condominium. They had
discussed this with the Townhouse Association, and this was �•rhat the Associat3on wanted�
so they decided to do 3t this way. N!x'. Boardman stated he had gone over this with Bob
Aldrich and there ��ould be an emer�ency cross-over road for emergency vehicles. The
tennis courts would be across from the Recreation Center, which is what the people want.
Mr. Peterson stated there had been a lot of �T�edtmonearwi h thenCity�forstennisicourts�
area. The Darrel A. Farr Corporation had esc o y
and asked if �thase were the courts.
Mr. Bo�rdman stated that money was not for these tennis courts� but for two additional
courts to be located somewhere by the City. ,
Mr. Peterson stated the problem was iha� with the building the Farr Corpora�ion had done
in this area� they erere gettin� a lot of pressure ior additional tennis courts, and. with
the amount of building in the area� there was no land availabl.e to build the courts on.
Mro Peterson sicated he had diificulty wit;h puttirx� �ennis courts in �here if they would �
only be for C�sed landsfrom the�FarraCorporatianrtlaatldo noic�have tennis courts andawere
who have pur
putting pressure on the City.
Mr. Boardman stated there was a possibility of placing the tennis courts on the Grace
High School property.
Aqr. Peterson stated � tPeterson s�at d�irt Farrhhadaput anloteofehousescup there�ar.deit
wovldn't �et that.
was easy to give money' but what they needed was property.
Mr. Boardman noted thaic they had at least gotten the money� and regardless of which
development it was� they would still b.ave a problem, because they didn't get property.
Mr. Boardman stated that there would be a lot of area within the complex itself thrxt
would be outside the construction limits that �rould be left natural. They would try
to le�ee this area as wooded as poss3.ble and as natural as possible.
All of the unit s
would be put in as separate, clear-cut units so �hey woul.dn't be �oing throu�h and
cuttin� a wY�ole slice out as they did in the Villa�es. They felt that was a mistake
and this time would clear out only enough area to build each individual unit��whiBpardman
would be more expensive but would be better for selling the units later on. .
stated there �aoald be no variances needed and Staff had no problem with the �y �hese
units were layed out. �'• B�r�n itsWe�hich wou�ldshaveeseparatelblocks and otsS
which explained the.design of the un �
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PLAx+1NING COMMISSION MEETING, JANtJARY 10, �979 - PAGE 3
Mr. Boardman stated. there wou].d be more �han adequate parking atal].s. When they went
in with eight units per building they ��ere required to hav� 14 parkin� stall.s per
� buildin� and they had allowed 16 parkin� stalls per building. They then went to 6 units
per building� but did not chan�e the parking plans. Also they had planned on a
recreationAl vehicle parking area� but that may or may not remain a part of the plans�
because there was some concern from other people wha wou].d use that area.
Mr. Peterson asked if this would be a separate Townhouse Association.
Mr. Board.man stated it would be a part of the present Assoeiation.
Mr. Oquist asked if �he tennis court near the Recreation Buildin� �aas 3n addition to
the two courts money had been escrowed for.
Mr. Baardman stated the tennis court near the Recreation Bu:tldir�g was a private Association
� tennis court and the intent �aas tha,t the other two City tenn.is co�arts would placed
somewhere 3n the area.
MSr. Oquist asked if he meant they would be placed in the Innsbruck area.
Mr. Boardman stated they would be placed wherever th�y coial.d find a location for them.
They may have to place them down by the Moore Lake Beach area.
Mr. Peterson stated that the Parks and Recreation Commission�would not vote for the
courts to go tMere� because they already have courts on Moore Lake and the people in
Innsbruck want them in Iunsbruck. �
� Mr. Boardm�n g�ve the Commissioners a letter from the North Innsbrucls Townhouse Assa�
ciation� and noted that in the preliminary discussions� the Association approved of
the general plans.
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Mr. Thomas Johnspn of the Darrel A. Farr Corporation came forward and made the following
presentatione Mr. Johnson showed tha Commissioners an artists drawin� of the townhouse
struciure. There wou].d be 6 units per building. They would try ta use the topograpY�y
as it exis�s� leaving green areas. The buildings wer� designed with the topo�rapY�y in
minde They s�axted out in �he early 1970�s with an approved plan unit development for
850 units in the Innsbruck North complex. Phase I was 102 �ownhouses� Phase II was the
Black Forest with 258 units apartment build3xzg, Phase I?I k�as the 56 Vienna, units'
Phase N was the 46 privacy units on the ex�reme south end of the complex� and the Phase V
with 96 Villa�e units, for a total of 558 units and the proposed plat for the 5th i�ddition
would have 78 units, for a total of 636 which is 214 units less than the approved PUD.
The 5th Addition would be named Foutain Oaks,.but at this time they w311 refer to.it as
Plat 5. There taould be 78 tow�ahouses en 9.� acres with 12�+ covered parking places and
10� uncovered places which means every other resident cou].d hsve two garages. They have
more than adequatel�y provided for off-street parkin� and garages, Regarding �reen areas�
they not only provided large green areas on the perimeter but wou].d be leavin� small
areas in the groupings of buildings. They believe they can develop the area and leave
tl�ose areas natural with the oak trees and also provide such natural amenities as rock
gardens� benches and tables. They would also have a portion of the area for trails which
would adjoin existing trails in the other additions, for a total of about 2 1�2 miles of
trails. These trails would also connect with the City trails.
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PLAIdNING CO2�IISSION MEETING, JANUARY 10, 1q79 - ___ PAGE k V
Mr. Johnson continued and stated they would have 78 total units, 39 of which would
be called B units which would have one bedroom with a loft� selling ior $�+5�9C)0 to
$47,500. The C units would have two bedrooms and two stories and would sell for
$59,5� to $63,000. The E units would have one b�droam �rith a sitting are� and would
sell for $46�500 to $48�500• They did people studies and determined ther.e �ould be
2.9 people per townk►ouse. With 54 privacy units that would total 156 people. Their
experience indicates that toFmhouses with 2�3rds l bedroom units should develop about
1.5 people. With 78 units that would equal about 117 people. Therefore they didn°t
feel they would be generating a lot of additional peo�le which Would cause traffic
or amenity problems. With 78 units with 1.3 bedxooms �the total would be about 9�+ to
96 people. Nlr. Johnson stated they were a HOW builder (Homeowners Waranty) and
were concerned about maintenance on the new buildings. Plat 5 would have 63�250 square
feet of blacktop which would be private s�reets rriaintained by the A$sociation. Plat
5 would have 13 buildin� wi�th a ground cover of �+2�300 square �'eet. The lawn area to
be maintained would be 80�000 square feet. Because they can cut the build3.ngs into the
natural cantour and individually grade each building they would have 75�000 square feet
of ground cover and end up with 120�000 square feet of lawn area to be main�ained.
With this proposal there would be almost twice as much roofin� and siding maintenance
as there wou].d have been with the original proposal. The targe� date gor completion
would be mid-1J$l. Wi�Ch this proposal they would leave �+3°� of the plat undiyturbed.
Mr. Storla asked �rhere the park trails would lead into the city trails.
Mr. Johnson stated there were trails �:n the area called the Villages which went around
the Black Forest and connected up with City trails in the park. They would be black
top trails.
A�. Storla asked F�here the tennis courts would got if th3s area was platted as proposed.
Mr. Boardman stated �hey could �o in the City park property behind the �lack Forest, n
but they would then become apartment tennis courts. Another alternative was the Farr
Lake area, but that would disturb the passive lake area. Another alternative would be
the wooded property behind Grace High School or on the property by the closed elementary
school.
Nir. Storla asked if all the people in the area belonged to one association.
Mr. Boardman stated there were two associations: The Townhouse Association and the
Villages Association.
Mr. Oquist asked if there would be an�y draina�e problems from the surfaced areas.
Mr. Johnson stated that when they had previously platted this area� i-t was taken before
the Rice Creek Wntershed people. They are on the agenda� but feel this could be
handled atecause thereewouldebeulesstblacktoprthan in�thebother siteshe�They feelethere
dra3.nage b
would be no problem.
ris. Schnabel asked if there would be a formal plan for water retention and runoff.
Nir. Boardman stated they had a formal plan and there would be several retention basins ,
and a ponding area.
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PTaANNING C01�4ISSION MEETING� JANUARY 10, 197� __ - PAGE y
Ms. Schnabel st�ted she was concerned about the landscaping. In the last development
�f tcwnhouses, they were assured that the retention of the trees was a strong sellin�
point� but as the development proceeded� almost every tree was taken down.
Mr. Farr stated thst the discussion at that point in time was one of degree. How many
trees could they save Frith the 96 townhouse units versus how marry could they save tai�h
the 251 apartment units. It was a relative discusaian in which they stated they could
save more trees with the townhouses which they did. They are few in number and would
have been non-existent ii they had built the 251 units. The City has on file a cut
and fill map that was submitted with �he 251 unit plan in 1972o They a].so have the
cut and fill map that was submitted when they built the q6 townhouse units. There are
more trees there now than there would have been if they had buil� the 251 unit apartment
building. As far as the landscaping was concerned, they presen�ed the landscaping plan
to the City and to the single family ho�eowners in the area� and also to the VA and FHA�
and that plan nas been complied with to the letter.
Nls. Schnabel asked if they were in the process of planting new trees 3n the area.
Mr. Farr stated they had planted over 120 trees so �ar.
Ma. Sehnabel asked what their in�ention was reg�rding the new development� 3f they would
have a landscaping plan for that.
Mr. Farr stated they fel� they could save a lot more trees in this development because oP
the physical character of the ground. They would cut in the streets and as they build
a building, they would excavate it like a house. The structures would not be much bi�er
than a house, the outside d3mensions ���ou1d be about 5�+ x 52. They expect to sa�ne a lot
of the natural cover. To the extent t�a� they disturb the natur�l cover� they woul.d plant
trees and shrubs in accordance with what they have done in the balance of Innsbruck.
Ms. Schnabel stated �ha�L was why she t�ras concernede She felt that the land in the area
of the Villages was raped and was concerned tha,t it not happen a�ain� and would �.ike a
formal plan.
Nr. B oardman stated tiaey would have construction limi�s� which would mean they eould not
�o d3g somewhere else, they could only dig up the amount of land necessasry to excavate
each building.
Mr. Johnson stated that planned to leave 43p of the area in its natural iorm.
Ms. Schnabel asked if they intended to put in a swi�nin� pool.
NYr. Farr stated that had been dropped from the original plan.
Ms. Schnabel asked if a pool �aere included� who would be using it.
Mr. Farr stated it would be for the North Iniasbruck Townhouse Association people.
Ms. Schnabel mentioned that NLr. Johnson� in his presentation, had mentioned a B unit,
a C unit and an E unit. She asked if there was a D unit� tahich she had noticed on the
plan.
N6r. Johnson stated the D unit wauld be the same as the C unit.
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PLANNING CONJMISSION MEETING JANUARY 10� 1 7 - PAGE 6 '
Ms. Schnabel read the letter fxom the North Innsbruck Townhouse Association which
was addressed to the Darrel A. Farr Development Corporation. The letter was as
follows: Dear Mr. Farr� The members of the Innsbruck Nortii Townhouse Association
Board of Directors has informally considered your revision presented January 3, 1979
of the replattirig of the 5th Addition. The plan for 13 townhouse structures �ith 6
units per structure is 3.n general acceptable. A final decision must be reserved
until specifications for the revised replat have been obtained and reviewed. A
written agreement between your Corpora�ion and InnsbrucY. North Townhouse Association
specifying the actual plans� the amenities� and a meani.ngful working a�reement during
the development of the 5th Addition will be necessary for final approval. We appreciate
your willin�ness to accomoclate our needs in your revised plan and see �OElainenHummel�
such an a�reement should not be obtainabl.e by mid-F'ebruary. Sincerely�o Richard Peterson�
Vice President� Innabruck North Townhouse Association. A carbon copy
and the City of Fridley.
MOTION by Nls. Schnabel, seconded by Mr. Oqu3st� that the letter from the Innsbruck
North Townb.ouse Association be received into the record..
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UPON A VOICE VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE� ACTING CAAIRMAN PETERSON DECLARED TAE MOTION CARRIED
UNANIMOUSLY.
Mr. Stephen Tollison� 5538 N��ster Road, came forward and sta'Ced h� T��sonestatedhe
Board of Directors of the Innsbruek North Townhouse AssociaAine�asletter was distributed
that 2a month1y newsl.etter was printed by the Association.
].ast Saturday to 160 members oi the Associ�tion. In that neF�sletter they mer��ioned the
pro�osed replat of Plat 5. At tha'� time there was still a question as to whether there
would be condominiums or townhouses. In the newsletter� they asked the members to call
1�1rr Tollison alone received �
a member of the Board of Direc�COrs if they had ar_y comments. .
22 phone calls from members of the Association who were willing to come to �his meeting
of the Planning Commission. .After the newsletter was issued' the decision �o go with�e
townhouses and a general agreement regarding structure and design had been reached.
other thin�s �he members were concerned abou-� were �:he t�nnis courts The people were also
pool was included in the plans presented to the Board of Directors.
concerned about the green �reas and the trees and had the same comments Ms.
Schnabel. had
voiced at this meeting. The residents were concerned about the numbers of trees lost in
the Villages. Nir. Tollison stated that as far as recreational facili�ies were concerned�
they had only 1 pool and 1 tennis court. With the addition of over 100 families� there
must be provisions for more tennis courts. The existing tennis court �.as not even �een
finished yet. When i'lat 4 was platted, �here ti�ere to be three tennis covrts for the I
Association peopZe to use. A�t this time there was only one court, which was unfinished�
and �the other two bave not been started. There has to be a provision for a specific
].ocation for the other two cou�'ts. As i� stated in the letter� everything must have a
timetable and be written explicitly. Regarding the green areas� they would like to know
exactly which trees will be saved and which will be lost. They have to rely on the City
in this. They are happier with this proposal than they were witFa��eWOUld�lg�nep�the•
Mr. Tollison stated thet When consi;ruction is completed and Mr.
Association would be left and they �rere concerued that thin�s should be done properly
so �6hey would not be left with problems.
�. Peterson statedithat it sho h3chehe�had the right tordevelopatilf heyphaargop ns
and it was I�a Farr s property
with apar-�ments rather than Villages there would have been no trees.
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�PLA�RlING COMMISSION MEETING� JANUARY 10, i979 - PAGE 7
Mr. James Pries, 55�+5 E. Bevarian Pass came forward and. stated he wae also a member
of the Board. Mr. Pries stat�d he agreed with Mr•. Tollison°s statements and also
_;._,� wi-�h the letter from the Associa�Cion. Mr. Pries stated that before they reach an
'agreement� they would like more tirne to review the proposal and would like tlie
epecifications in srriting. I� . Pries stated that they view tlae Association as a
busineas, and that when the developer leaves� everythin� is their responsibility.
Mr. P�ies asked the CorrBnissioners for their support in reaching an agreement with
the Darrel A. Farr Corporation. �
Ms. Schnabel asked when this item would �o to Council i7� it was approved by the Planning
Commission at this meeting.
Mr. Boardman stated it would go to Cou.neil on January�22nd.. At tha�L meetin�� Council
would set a da�Ce for the public hearing� February 12th' and would be acted on by the
Counc3l on February 26th. A��er that there would be the first and second reading of the
plais� so the project wouldn't be approved until the end of March.
Mr. Peterson noted that there would be another meetin� of the Plannin� Commission in
two weeks and ii the Plannin� Commission waited unti� that meeting to act on this� it
would give the Corporation and the Association two weeks to reach an agreement without
upsetting the timetable too much.
Mr. Boardman stated it would set the City Council public hearing back until March.
Mr. Peterson asked Mr. Farr what his startin� date was.
Mr. Farr stated that when they met with the Board of Directors of the Association� they
� suggested to the Board' aftea° conversations wiich the City Staff� that Council would
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act on this 30 days after the Planning CoYmnission meeting. They suggested to the Board
that the considerations t�o be workzd out could be worked out during �the 30 day periozl
between the Planning Co�nission meeting a�nd the Ci�y �ounc�,l meeting. I✓�r. Farr suggested
that the Pl�nning Commission give their approval with the s�tipulation tha't the To�rnhouse
Assoc3ation and the Darrel A. Farr Corpora�ion reach an agreement pra.or to �he City
Council mee�ting. Mr. Farr stated he fe].�C some of the problem� could be resolved ri�ht
now� like the tennis courts, and others wauld have to be discussed and n�gotiated.
Mr. Peterson stated� as Chairman of �the Parks and Recreation Commission, he was concerned
abou$ the tennis courts. Tf they took the e�crowed money from the Daxrel A. Farr Corp-
oration and put two tennis courts on Moaxe Lake� people would be very upset. Mr.
Peterson stated the City was also to blame for the situation' that money was escrowed
for tennis courts with no place ico put them.
Mr. Farr stated they had a�reed to provide three tennis courts. The first tennis court
was in the existin� home of the Association area. The a�reement was that this court be
constructed after they had constructed 20 homes in �ihe �+th Addition. That had been done.
The developmen� agreement for the Tn�sbruek Vi].lages provided that they would pay for
two tennis courts at a location ico be deter�nined by the City of Fridley. That was to
be done after they had sold 40 Village units. They have been ready to build the tennis
enurts since 1977. When the City tells them where they tirant them� they r�i11 build them.
Mr. Peterson reiterated that the City was as much to b].ame as the Darrel A. Farr
Corporation.
n M�. Tollison reiterated that with more people coming in� the present residents would
'" be upset uriless provisions were made for additional recreational facilities in the
form of a pool or tennis courts. ,
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PLANNING COMMISSION MEETZNG, JANUARY 10, 1979 -_ PAGE 8. �
Mr. Toliison also s�a�ed they were also concerned about a beginning and an endin�
date. Time frames were very importanic.
Mr. Langenfeld stated he was sorry to be late and asked iP the quest3on of drainage
had been discussed.
Mr. Peterson stated that drainage had been discussed. The Rice Creek Watershed people
h�d not yet given their approval� but no problems were anticipated. There would be
adequate ponding areas and retention basins.
Ms. Schnabel asked �rhat the width of' the streets �oing through the development ti�ould
be. •
N�. Farr stated. the streets would be 30 feet wide and there would be no parking on the
streets. There would be three off-street parkin� spaces per unite
Ms. Schnabel asked if these spaces would be the actual entrances to the gara�es.
Mr. Johnson stated that was correct.
Mr, Storla asked what the interior dimensions would be for the smallest unit.
I�. Johnson stated that the interior living space in the sm�llest unit would be 850 square
feet includin� the loft� which is the bedroom.
N1r. Boardman siated that met the code.
MOTION by Mr. I�angenf'eld, seconded by Ms. Schnabel to close the public hearing. /'�,
UPOIJ A VOICE VO'I'E� ALL VOTIIVG AYE� ACTING CH:�I�I�`�AN PETERSON DECLARED THE PUBLIC I�ARING
CLOSID AT 9:16 P.M.
MOTION by Mr. Oqui.st� to recomanend to Counci]. approval of the cons3deraand�a�Townhose
posed preliminary plat� P.S. #78-07� Innsbruck North Townhouse Plat 5�
development� T-�;�78-01� Fountain Oaks� by Darrel A. F�rr Development Corporation: Being
a replat of Outlot H� Innsbruck North� except �that part already platted as Inr�sbruck
North' Second and Third Additions� generally located North of I.69�+� between Nleis�er
Road and the Corporate Limits of the City of Fridley� with the stipulation tlzat a
memorandum of agreement be reached between the Darrel A. Farr Development Corporation
and th� Innsbruck North Townhouse Association� prior to action by the Ci�ty Council.
Mr. Storla stated he would like a better understandi� of what the a�reement taould
encompass.
N�. Peterson stated the request w�s that there be an agreement bet�reen the Townh�°issions
Association and the Darrel A. Farr Development Corpoxation, and the Planning
approval would be based on them reaching an agreement.
Nlr. Oquist pointed out tha�t ii their concerns �aere not covered� there taould not be any
agreement. �
Ms. Schnabel stated she �'o ssion would notigive�theireapproval,an agreement was not �
reached, the Planning Co�i
PLANNING COt�lISSION ML'�'TING, JAtViJARY 10� �97g -_ _ PAGE �
Motion died for lack oP a second.
A�CYI'ION by Ms. Schnabel, seconded by Mr. Oquist� to recommend to Council approval of
� Consideration of a proposed preliminary plat� P.S. �78m07, Innsbruc�s North Townhouse
Plat 5� and a townhouse development� T-#'j8-Ol� Fountain Oaks� by Darrel A. Farr Develop-
ment Corporation: Being a replat of Outlot H� Tnnsbruck North� except that pnrt already
platted as Innsbruck Nor�th Townhouse Plat �+� �nd parts of Innsbruck North Second and
I� Third Additions, generally located north of I.6g4, bet�reen Meister Road and the Corporate
Limits of the City Oi Fridley, with the sti ulation that a memorandvm of agreement be
,, re�ched And signed by the_Innsbruck P1or�h Townhouse tissociation and the Darrel A. Farr
Development Corporation. In the event that an a�reement cannot be reached, the proposal
vtould be returned to the Planning Co�niss�on
Follo�ain� stipulation� �rere also included:
noise prablems similiar to the th Additian.
Dis�crict. 3 Performance Bond ior the exteri
The walkways be con�pleted and ligh�ed� an
and all other easements for wa ways in a
a timetable to be set.
�oes on to t
i�ts be filed
va1 a�' the �i
men� be place
r waZkw�ays �ri
s be finalize
�� Co�uncil o
th� plat on
�eek Lwatersh
h the Cit.v.
Mr. Langenfeld stated he was concerned about the environmental aspects of the development
and would assume that the Association would take all those items into consideration. Mr.
Lar.i�eni'eld stated he wished they had the Tnterium Agreement type of ordinance. N1r.
Lan�enfeid stated that they had made a tour of the area and had found draina�e problems
in other areas. The Interium Ordinance being considered by the City Council would insure
that before a�y development takes place� proper measures would be taken to insure that
there not be any environmental impact to the area.
;, Mr. Peterson stated that the fact �that they h�d made the stipulata.on that tl�e Ric�
;� Creek Watershed. people �ive their approval of the developmen� would inake him feel. very
comfortable. They have the expertise and engineering background and if they a�ree tha�t
j there would be no advexse efiect to the environment� he w�uld feel comfortable.
�1
UPON A VOICE V4TE, pLL VOTII�TG AYE� ACTTNG CHAIRMAN PETERSON DECLARED THE MOTTON GARRIID
IJNA14'Il+'iOliS"LY .
Nlr. Peterson st�ted that a time�able was set, the members of the Associa�Cion Board had
heaxd the motion with the stipulations� had seen the concern of the Commissioners and
the Developer' and hoped that through the Staff and their negotiations every�hin� woutd
be agreed upon and 3f not, Ms. Schnabel's motion was that it be brought back to the
Planning Coaunission.
Mr. Tollison thanked �he Commissioners.
P�r. Peterson turned the chairma.n over �o Vice Chairman Langenfeld.
�+. VACATIOIV REQUEST, SAV �'j8-05� VIKING ENGINEERTNG AND DEVEL�PMENT COMPANY: Vacate
the easement for drainage and utilities that was retained when Gumwoal Stree� was
vacated (SAV �78-12� Houser), except that part actually needed by the util3ty
eompanies� described as follows: The easement lying between Block 5 and Bluck 6�
Onaway Addition, and bounded on the North by the Wester],y extension of the North
line of Block 6� Onaway Addition� and bounded on the South by the Westerly extension
of the South line of Lot 11� �lock 6� Onaway Addition� to allow the enclosure of a
stora�e dock at 77�+0 Beech Street NeE.
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PLANNIrdG CONQ�lISSIOAT MEEPING, JANUARY 10, �979 - PAGE 10 ,�
_ ...
Mr. Boardman stated that pa�e 23 of the agenda books indicated tha� Gumwood Street
was already vacated� however �hen that street was vacaiced� the utilities were not
vacated. Therefare� they still have 50 feet of easement �or utility easement. The
condition they are looking at then at the address 77�+0 Beech Street was that they �;.�
have a loading platform at the back of their building that was on that portion of
vacated street easement uncler which there�was also a utility es,sement. At �his point
in time, they had contacted the utility cr�mpanies to find out if they need that 50
foot easement. Tbey said they didn't need that 50 foot easement� but in the letter
they got back� the utility company did not indicate what easement they do need. They
had sent out a second lett�r, but had only gotten one response back anc3 that was from
NSP. They attempted to call them today� but did not get a� hold of them to �et that
clarified as to the amount of easemenic they do need. MinniGasCo said they had no
utili�ies in that a]1ey�aay so had no reason �o hold any easement. NSP does have a
powerline there. In the letter the City received from the�a� they want to hold the
easterly 10 foot of the z•resterly 27 foot of tbat v�cated street and as far as the
telephone compar�y� they have not hee,rd from them. From the �nitial letters, it did
not look like �here would be ar,y problems with any of the utiliicy companies re�arding
this. Mr. Boa�xdm�n recommended that the Flanning Commission reco�unend approval con-
tingent upon wha�ever response they get from the other utilities to hold whatever
easement they need to hold. They can �hen be�i�� processi.n� this and by the time it
gets to Council� they would have all of the easements.
Mr. Peterson asked, regarding the letter from NSP dated December 1, 1978� if the 14
foot hi�ht requirement was valid� or if it could go higher.
N1r. Bosrdman stated Viking Engineering wanted to cover their loading dock and gave the
Co�nnissioners � copy o� a letter from NSP.
Mr. Peterson read the letter as follo�s: When the City of Fridley vacates the 50 foot ,-.�
street easement for Gumcwood Street� NSP would like to have a 10 foot easement main-tained
for their existin� overhead lineo ide intend ta move the southerly pole approximately
23 feet west by the end of Febru�ry� �97g, to lin° up �ai'�h the other poles. We would
then ask tha�t �he east 10 feet of the westerly 27 feet of the vacated Gumwooc'� Street
easement be maintained for -that line. I hope this wi].l rueet with approval by all con-
cerned. Sincerely, Harlan Benson, Customer Serv�ce Representative.
MOTION by Mr. Peterson, seconded by Ms. Schnabel, that the letter from NSP be received
into the record.
UPON A VOICE VOTE9 ALL VOTTIVG AYE, VICE CHAIRMAI� LANGENFELD DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED
UNANII�OL�LY .
Ms. Schnabel asked� re�arding the east 10 feet of the west 27 feet� if that means they
would encroach on that easemen� 2 feet into the easterly half.
Mr. Boardman s�ated that was correct, they woua.d have 2 feet of easement on their pro-
perty.
Ms. Schnabel stated that then any addition th°y make can only come within 2 feet of the
peoperty line on the west side. •
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PLANNING CONIlKISSION N�TING, JANUARY 10, 1979 - PAGE 11
Mr. Earl Johnson� General Mana�er of Vikin� Engineering Development Corporation came
forward and stated that Gumwoad w�s a 50 Poot street thaic was vacated.. At that time�
Paske was the builder at that time and he put in a dock that did u�e 25 feet. The
,� first request they would make woutd be for a variance for setback. The reasan �they
want to cover the loadin� dock was that �hey have a problem in the win�er wi�h snow
and ice. They make a heavy piece of eguipment and ].oading is almost impossible.
Mr. Boardman indicated to them that the utilities had not been vacaiced �nd much to
their surprise were under the dock area considerin� the occupancy permit rendered on
their property. Ho�•rever �hat woua.d be OK. P�r. Johnson stated that the telephone
compt�ny had indicated in their letter that� regardin� the cable under the dock� they
would be responsible for any expense involved. Putting a cover on top of the dock
�rould not change that at a11. The power company was concerned a little abou'c where
the power comes into their building. It comes into the wall and they have a metal
building9 so they �rould need a certain �amount of fbotage between the metal to have a
�round. The most logical thing would be to ex�end the ma,st for the entry. Their
pole would not effect them in a�y way, because it was located mid-way on the 25 feet.
The gas company and Cable TV indicated no concern. MinnigasCo was concexned about
lot 6 and l�t 7. They own lo�s 6� 7� 8, and 9. I,ots 8 and 9 are the�.r parking area.
Mr. Peterson asked Mr. Johnson if they were still plannin� on building the cover on],y
l�+ feet h3�h.
Mr. Johnson stated l�+ fee� would be sufficient� because the truck does not come in�o
that area� they anly uae the dock to bring the produc� to the truck.
Mr. Langenfeld asked if �he access was north and south oP Gumwood.
Mr. Boardman stated iche access was off of Beech Stree�.
^' NfOTION by Mr. Peterson, seconded by Mr. Oquist� to recomnend to Council �pproval of the
Vacation Request, SaV #78-059 Viking Engineering �nd Developmen�t Company: Vacate the
easement for drainage and utilities that w�s retained when Guirtwood Street was vacated
(SAV �'(3�12p Houser)� exc�pt that part actually needed by �the utili�y companies�
described as follows: The easement lying between Block 5 and Block 6� Onaway Addition�
and bounded on the North by the Westerly extensa.on of the Nox°th line of Block 6, Onaway
Addition� and bounded on the South by the Westex�ly estension of the South line of Lot 11�
Block 6, Onaway Addition, to allow the enclosure of a storage dock at 77�+0 Beech S�treet NE.9
wi�h the stipulation that b� the time the request goes to City Council� all the
necessary documents are received 1°rom the utili�y co�anies indicating �he exac�C loca�ion
o� the easements needed and also �he stipulat� n tha� at�proval for th� necessary
variences �re received frotn the A�ueals Commissione
UPON A VOICE VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE� VICE CAAIRNNIAN LANGENFELD DECLARED THE MOTION C.ARRIED
U�TTANIMOUSLY .
Mr. Jbhnson thanked the Commissioners. ,
Ms. Schnabel stated that the Appeals Cov�3.ssion had tabled this item and it was not
on the agenda for the next meeting.
N�. Boardman stated he would see about �ettin� it on the agenda.
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PLANNING CONQ�IISSIOId MEETING, JANUARY 10, �79 - _ PAGE 12 '
Vice Chairman Langenfeld declered a recess at 9:�+5 and reconvened the meetin� at
10:00 P.M. . "
5. RECEIVE ENVIROPdMENTAL
. ti.
CONII�ITSSION MINUTES: NOVEP��R 21 197�:
r ior Commi.ssion Use: pages 10 and. 11)
MOTIOIV by Ntr. Peterson� seconded by Ms. Schnabel to receive the November 21� 1978,
Environmental Quality Commission minutes.
Ms. Schnabel asked what the term "awau group" meant on pa�e 6 of the minutes.
Mr. I,an�enfeld stated that was a elan� expression meaning one �rlth superior knowledge
and quali�ties to re�ke proper decisions.
Mr. Langenfeld asked 3i Mr. Boardman was aware if the City Council had directed the
city attorney to take le�al means to prevent �r�y s�atus change oP the airport as
requested on page � of the minutes.
Mr. Boardman sta�ed he did not know.
I�, Langenfeld stated that the second paragraph on page 7 a�d the second para�raph on
page 8 were the key para�raphs regarding the discussion on the airport.
Mr. Boarc�man asked what was me�nt by the statement "Tlie Environmental Impact Statement
was hired by MAC as another step tnwara that impiementatione"
Mr. Peterson st�ted he understood that to mean that the MAC had hired a iirm to make an
environmental impact statemen�.
Mre Boardman �sked if they• weren't required by the Federal Government to do that.
Ms. Schnabel stated they were if they were �oing to change the airport froffi a minor to
an 3ntermediate. So that statement means they are p�:anning to do �chat or e].se they
would not have hired someone to do an environmental impact s�atement. .
Mr. Boardman asked if the3r intent all along was to make it an intermediate airport.
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IV�, I,angenfe].d stated the MnDOT!'�B>1an had been compiled., �nd was vague. They seem to be doing
things in stages� such as puttinwasnconcernedhabou� m�They wouidllike toeseeWthe Master
and this is what the Commiss�.on
Plan.
Mr. Lan�enfeld asked Mr. Boardman�
Chaix�man ws�ite le�tters to various
person to do that.
regarding several motions in the minutes that the
people� if that was within the scope of the Chair-
Mr. Boarclman stated that ax�y let�er which states an opinion or takes a stand should
have approval of the City Council. Letters seeking adviee or information would be
no problem. ,
Mr. I,angenfeld asked� regardin� the motion on page 9� if the Council had done an,ythj.ng
regr�rd3ng that motion, and if the motions should be directed to the Plannin� Coa�ission
also.
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� PLANNTAIG CONIMISSION 1�ETING, JANUARY 10, 1.g79 - PAGE 1?
Mr. Peterson stated he felt that the action in that particular motion wou].d be out
of' order because the direct reportin� route would be the sub-commission to the
.;.�,: Plannin��Com�ission to the City Council, and no comnil.ssion would have the authori�y
�- �CO �o dix�ectly to any other governmental body stating a position.
Mr. Langenfeld asked if any commission could by-pass the Pl�nnin� Corr�ission� and make
a motion directly to the City Council.
Mr. Board�n s�ated that all of �heir motions were directed to the City Counci].� those
motions �ppear before the Plannin� Cor�nission because of the review process. If the
Planning Commission feels the mo�ion effects the comprehensive plan or the policies
that had been e�tablished9 it could act� but would not have to.
I�1r. Peterson stated that he would consider the motian on page 8 regardin� the M.P.C.A
to be out oi order because there the Commiseion was taking d.irect action without
approval of the Ci�y Council.
Mr. Lan.genfeld st�ted he was glad he brought the i.ssue up and had it cleared up.
NSc. Boardman stated the motion on page 5 regard.ing New Brighton would also be cons3dered
out o� order.
Mr. Langenfeld s�ated the second para�raph on page 10 was of interest and the Co�issi.oners
shou].d read it .
I�ro Langen�eld asked if the City had done anythin� regarding recreation.aZ vehicles as
discussed on rage 12.
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Mre Peterson stated tha� Bob Shore had puxcl�a.sed that property and the City had an
agreement iaith them simi�.iar ta the one they had last year with Sears9 allowing them
to use the proper�ty for �.�ecreational vehicles' unt�.l he developes it.
Mr. Langenfeld s�Cated that the word or�anization on page 1.3� the first p�ragraph� the
first se�;�ence should be changed to read "collection - re-cycling center".
UPON A VOICE VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE, VICE CAAIRMAN LANGENFELD DECLARED TBE NlO�'ION CARRIED
iJPdANIMOUSLY .
5. (A� PURCHAS'� OF TAPE RECORDER FOR CO1�;ISSION USE: PAGES 10 and 11;
Mr. Langenfeld stated the Environmenal Quality Coa�aission would like to purehase a
tape recorder in order to tape such things as the City Council meeting over the MnDOT
Plan� etc. The Com¢nission i;hot�ht other commissions might be interested in sbr�ring it.
Ms. Schnabel stated that the Appeals Connnission �rou].d not be interested.
Mr. Storla stated liis Commission had not discussed a need for one recently, but felt
it was a reasonable request� to have a tape recorder available to the Commissions.
Mr. Langenfekd asked if �Lhey would be allo�,red to purchase one with their budget money.
Mr. Baardman stated they were allowed, but it would have to be approved by the City
�., Council.
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PLANNING CON�?ISSLON MEETING, JANUARY 10, 1979 - PAGE l� �
Mr. Peterson stated the Parks and Recreation Commiss�on had not discussed this� but
personally felt that Commissions would be �etting far afield by tapin� all k3nds oY
public meetin�s because in the first place it would be setting a prec�dent and in the
second p].ace� he could not see where the information would be used, because who was
�oing to set and listen to a four hour tape. Al]. public meetings were supposed to
have minutes and they could request the minutes. The official testimo�y oP a pub].ic
meeting would be the minutes� not a tape of the meeting.
6. RECEIVE PARKS AND R�CREATIOIV COMMISSIOPI MINUTES: NOVEMBER 27� 1978:
MOTION by Mr. Peterson� seconded by Ms. Schnabel to receiee the November 27� 1978�
minutes of the Parlcs and Recreation Cozmnission.
Mr. Peterson stated the Parks and Recreat�o n Co�nniss�n had voted to go to six meet3ngs
a year with the option to schedule special meetings. The meetings had been scheduled
to occur just before a new ac-tivi�y or season be�ins.
UPON A VOICE VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE� VICE CHATRMAN LAIVGENFELD DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIID
UNANIMOUSLY.
7. RECEIVE APPEALS CONR�9ISSION MINiJTES: DECEI�ER 12, 1978:
MO'FIO1V by Ms. Schnabel, seconded by Mr. Peterson to receive the December 12� 1978�
minutes of the Appeals Coumaission.
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Ms. Schnabel noted that the bottom of page 5 and the top of page 6 covers a discussion
of a letter from Vir�il Herricke This item was discussed in depth at the ner.t meetin��
December 26� 1978. Ms. Schnabel also stated they would be discussing the zQnin� ,.
oz°�.inance changes at the January 16� 197� meeting oi the Appeals Co�iission.
UPON A Va�CE VOTE� ALL VQTIIVG AYE� VICE CHATRM�IN LANGENFELD DECLARED THE Ri0TI0N CARRIED
UNANINiOUSLY.
$. RECEIVE EIWIRONMENTAL QUALITY COPM�IISSIOPJ MINUTES: DECEMBER 19, 1978%
MO'I'ION by Ms. Schnabel, seconded by Mr. Peterson to receive the December 19, 1978,
minutes of the Environmental Quality Coannission.
Mr. I,an�enfeld stated he was not able to attend that meeting.
Mr. Peterson asked who Mr. Perez was.
P�, langenfeld stated Mr. Perez taas a member of �he New Brigh.ton Environmental Commission�
and also on �he M. P. C. A.
Mr. Peterson stated he w�as concerned wi.th Mr. Perez°s statement on the bottom of the
first page, and was concerned because the Commission does not bave the authority to
do that.
NIr, Langenfeld noted that the Commission had discussed having the words "Draft Subject
to Final Approval" on the first p�ge of the minutes.
,�
, PT�NNING COMt�LCSSION MEETING, JANUARY 10, 1.979 - PAGE 1�
Mr. Boardma.n stated that the minutea of a meeting are ofiicial minutes� and are
subject to change, but the changes are offic3al also, �;hereiore they could not
"'s�� do that.
Ms. Schnabel stated she �elt that if corrections bring about substanic3.ve changes of
the proceeding o� the meetings� they should not b� allowed.
Mr. Boardman stated there could be problems in wh�t was heard by the public and. what
was in the minu�es� and those type of changes could chan�e �the conten�.
Nfr. Langenfeld brou�ht the at�ention af the Com¢nis�ioners to the motian on page 6�
where they h�,ve him writi.ng more letters.
�. Boardman s�ated that as Chairperson, Mr. Langenfeld had the au�hority to say no
to �hese mot:!ons.
UPON A VOICE VOT�� ALL VOTING AYE� VICE CHATRNfAN LANGENFELD DECLARED THE MOTTON CARRTID
UNANIriiOUSLY.
9. RECEIVE APPEALS CONlMTSSIOId MI1W�1.'ES: DECEA�ER 2f, 1978:
RZOTION by N:s. Schnabel' seconded by Mr. Peterson� to receive �he December 26� 1978'
minutes of the Appeals Commission.
N1s. Schnabel statecl that pages 5� 6 and 7 of the minutes covered. a d3scussion regardin�
a memo received from CounciL This memo was a research dating back to the ].9b0� coverin�
all actions taken regarding lots less than 50 feet. There was a request to put a new
structure on a�+0 foot lot. Included with that memo was a copy of a letter from the
city attorncy to a�ember of 8taff regarding tha't request. The Appeals Commission felt
that there were two con:flicting point •cha� had been made at the time the Commission heard
�he request. A motion was znade telZing Council that Appeals would be willing 4o re-
consider this request if the Council wan-�ed them to' and if they didn't want them to�
Council covld go ahead and handle it� when the 9U days were up. Msn �chYiabel stated
she had noted at the January 8th. City Council meeting' the Council had requested �he
it�m.be returned to the Board of Appeals for action. It did come to li;�ht' that 4he
Appeals Comani.ssion felt it was given erroneous 3nformation. Ms. Schnabel £elt this
would cause a very dif£3cult situation with re�ards �o the people in that neighborhoode
UPOIV A VOIG'E VOTE� ALL VOTING AYE� VIG`E CHAIRMATT LANG�NF'ELD DECLARED THE MOTION C�iRRIED
UTdANIMOUSLY.
10. RECEIYE ENERGY PROJECT CONII�'EE MINiF�ES: DECEMBER 13, 1978=
MOTION by Mr. Storla, secorlded Uy Ms. Sc%xiabel� �o receive the December 13� 1978�
minutes oi the Ener�,y Project Committee.
Mr. Peterson noted that Mr. Langenield �ad been elec�ted cl�airn►an of the Co�nittee.
Mr. Lan�;enfeld stated he appointed a vice chaix�an� and on the last pa�e of the mi.nutes�
they invited hYr. Harris to stay on the Commission.
Mr. Langenfeld stated the minutes contained a lot of vital information and mentioned
� that� as discussed on pa�e �+, they would like to obta3.n some pamphlets, in particular,
Key to Comi'ort .
A�r. Boardman stated he would look into gettin� them.
PLAI�1VItdG CONlMTSSION MEETIRTG� JANiTARY 10, �97g - PAGE 16 �
Mr. Lsngenfeld brought to Mr. Boardman°s �ttention the mot�.on on the bottom of page
7 requesting �taff to corapile ingormation regarding the increase in demand oP
Commercial and Inc�ustrial Sales between the years 1.976 ar�d 1977.
Mr. Peterson noted that a lot of new construction had taken place durin� that �er:Lod.
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Mr. Lan�enfeld mentioned the fact that this Co�i�tee would terminate in June.
UPON A VOICE VO'1'�� ALL VOTING AYE� VICE CHATRMAN LANGENFELD DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED . �/
UTdANIMOUSLY .
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11. CCNTINUED: MEMORANDUM OF AGREEMEPJT: �
Ms. Schnabel stated this item had been tabled and the Co�mmission had made the correction
at the beginning of the meeting.
12. CONTTNUED: PROPOSED CHANGES TO CHAPTER 205• ZONiNG:
MOTION by N:s. Schnabel� seconded by Mr. Peterson to continue the proposed changes to
Chapter 205. Zoning.
UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VO1^TNG AYEy VICE CHAIRMAN LANGENFELD DECLARED TFIE MOTION CA£RIED
UNANIMOUSLY.
13, oT� BUSZr�ss:
I�. Langenfeld stated he had received. a letter from the Charter Co�ai.ssion and asked
if the other Commissioners haa received ita
The other Commissioners sta�Ced that had received it.
�
Mr. Langenfeld stated he did not represent tki�s Co�n3.ssion and had asked if they would
delay action so that Planning could act and send recommendations �o the Charter Commissiono
The Charter Comm3ssion meets -�he first Tuesday of the month and there was no problem
in that respect and asked if the Cormni.ssioners would like to provide recommendations to
the Charter Co�nission regardin� these items. Mr. Langenfeld stated he had already
given his comments as a c3tizen.
N,r. Peterson stated he had also contributed his comments and �eco�nendations both as
a citizen and as Ch�irman of the Parks and Recreation Commission. He did not speak
for the Comanission but only for himself as Chairman.
Ms. Schnabel sta'ted she had also contributed her reeommendationso
Mr. S�Gorla stated he had not received it until yes�erday and was too ].ate to send a
letter� but would let them know.
Mr. I,angenfeld st�ted the Charter Commission had two openin„s.
N�, noard�n stated that the City Council had hired a consultant for the Downtown
Revitilization. They did hire Professional Planning and Development. They have
si�ned the contracts, �nd they would begin work on January 15, 1979•
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� t4a. SchnaUel r��ked iP the City Council had i,aken r�ny uci;ion re�r�rdin6 the Planning
Comm�i�aion's recommendutions concernin�; the fin�nc3.al ablig�tions of the bu�inesa
. cammunity.
Mr. Boardman stated he.wA3 not sure� but they had hired the consultan�.
.a"�
Mr. Peterson stated thz�t on Thur�day� January�25th� the Citizens Crime Prevention
Corrmiittee would be meetin�� and anyone who wnu].d li�e to attend was welcome.
MOTION b�� A4s. Schnabel, �econded by Mr. Peterson� to r�djourn the January 10� 1979�
meeting of the Plannina Commission.
UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE� VICE CHAIF,MAN LEINGENF'ELD DECLARED THE r�:ETING
ADJOURIVED A^1 11:05 P.M. ,
Respectfully Submitted:
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Iiat . 5,��11;on
Recording Secretary
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