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PL 11/03/1999 - 30977,� CITY OF FRIDLEY PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3,1999 CALL TO ORDER: Chairperson Savage called the November 3, 1999, Planning Commission meeting to order at 7:32 p.m. ROLL CALL: Members Present: Diane Savage, Brad Sielaff, Leroy Oquist, Dave Kondrick, Connie Modig, Dean Saba Members Absent: Larry Kuechle Others Present: Barbara Dacy, Community Development Director Missy Daniels, Code Enforcement Officer/Planner Scott Hickok, Planning Coordinator Brad Schieb, Hoisington Koegler Group, Inc. John Thompson, Cub Store Manager Mitch and Sue Nelson, 7680 Highway 65 N.E., Fridley Amoco Leigh Harris, President of Southem Anoka County ^ Chamber of Commerce Diane Wright — Chopper City Sports n APPROVAL OF OCTOBER 20. 1999. PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES: MOTION by Mr. Oquist, seconded by Mr. Sielaff, to approve the October 20, 1999, Planning Commission minutes as written. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE, CHAIRPERSON SAVAGE DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. 1. PUBLIC HEARING• ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT, ZTA #99-02. BY THE CITY OF FRIDLEY TO ALLOW FOR LIMITED TEMPORARY OUTDOOR DISPLAY AND SALES PROMOTIONS IN THE COMMERICAL DISTRICTS. IN ADDITION THE AMENDMENT WILL DELETE A PART OF THE ORDINANCE THAT ALLOWS DISPLAY OF PETROLEUM PROJECTS BETWEEN PUMPS AND TEMPORARY DISPLAY OF MERCHANDISE WITHIN FOUR FEET OF THE BUILDING AT SERVICE STATIONS: MOTION by Mr. Kondrick, seconded by Ms. Modig, to open the public hearing. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE, CHAIRPERSON SAVAGE DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED AND THE PUBLIC HEARING OPEN AT 7:40 P.M. �� PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 2 Ms. Daniels, Code Enforcement Officer, stated that the public hearing was regarding !�, temporary outdoor display and sales in the commercial districts. The City is proposing this draft ordinance. The City has received numerous requests from businesses around Fridley to hold a temporary outdoor sale or display in their parking lot or in front of their store. Currently the ordinance does not allow that type of selling. Planners need to make sure that ordinances are fair to the City; therefore, in order to serve the communities needs, they thought they should propose an amendment that would allow for outdoor sales. The goal of this ordinance is to provide the businesses with an opportunity to conduct their outdoor promotions and maintain an enhanced image of Fridley at the same time. Ms. Daniels stated the current ordinance allows display of petroleum products between pumps at service stations and temporary displays within four feet of the station buildings. It also allows garden centers, and similar uses with a special use permit. No other temporary or permanent outdoor displays or storage are allowed in any of those districts. Staff is proposing an ordinance amendment that allows up to three outdoor sales events per business per year in the commercial districts, C-1, C-2, and C-3. Staff is also proposing an administrative permit process for these events, rather than Planning Commission or City Council action. Staff is also proposing a ten-day timeframe for the promotion for 20 days befinreen each of the events. Ms. Daniels stated staff believes that the advantage of this type of ordinance is that it will allow businesses to conduct sales events that currently are not permitted. The three � events per year fall in befinreen the extremes of other cities. The City conducted research for comparison between the other cities in the metro area with their outdoor display ordinances. Blaine does not allow any outdoor displays; but if the outdoor displays are against the building, the City does not enforce the ordinance. This is a problem when there are things on the sidewalks and there is no wheelchair access or walking access. Brooklyn Center does allow two outdoor sales per year, ten days each. Brooklyn Park allows one promotional tent sale per year, per business, not to exceed ten days. This is part of their special use permit process. Columbia Heights allows outdoor sales with no clear regulations. Maplewood allows outdoor sales with no regulations. Sidewalk sales permits would be required to sell from a vehicle. Mounds View allows it in B-2 and higher which is compared to Fridley's C-1, C-2, and C-3 districts. They do have additional use permits for outside storage. Fridley's ordinance does not pertain to that because Fridley already has special use permits for permanent outdoor storage or displays like the garden centers. Ms. Daniels stated the proposed ordinance language in each district C-1, C-2, C-3, has the same wording for this particular use, so only C-1 has been included here. For C-2 it can be found at 205.14.1.C. (5). (b), and for C-3 it is 205.15.1C.(5) (a). 205.13 C-1 LOCAL BUSINESS DISTRICT REGULATIONS 1. USES PERMITTED ^ A. Principal Uses B. Accessory Uses I, I PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 3 (5). Temporary outdoor display sales or promotion of inerchandise � subject to the following conditions: a. The property owner shall obtain a Temporary Outdoor Display License from the City prior to starting the event. The property owner shall submit the information required on the license application. The City shall approve the license prior to commencement of the event. . b. A Temporary Outdoor Display License is required whether the merchandise is sold for profit or given away as part of a promotion. c. Only items associated with the principal use may be displayed. d. Three events per year are permitted, and shall occur no closer than 20 days apart. e. The duration of each event shall be no longer than 10 consecutive days. f. The merchandise shall be displayed in a manner that does not impede vehicular or pedestrian traffic or otherwise cause unsafe traffic conditions. g. The merchandise shall not be displayed in the boulevard or on any landscaped area. h. If a tent is to be used, the property owner shall obtain a building permit and comply with the requirements of the uniform building � code related to tents. i. Fees for tents shall be as established by the Uniform Building Code. j. The property owner shall pay the fees as established in Chapter 11 of the City Code. 11.10 Fees License fee shall be as follows: CODE SUBJECT FEE 205.30 Temporary Outdoor Display License $75.00 Ms. Daniels stated that the City is also proposing to delete some language from the ordinance. The current language allows the temporary displays in front of station stores like Super America or Holiday. The proposed deletion is in C-1, C-2, and C-3. Each section has the same wording for this particular use, so only C-1 has been included here. For C-2 it can be found at 205.14.1.C.(5).(b) and for C-3 it is 205.15.1.C.(5) (a). Ms. Daniels stated that if anyone needs a copy of these ordinances the City can send a ^ copy to them. Ms. Daniels read the deletion as follows: � PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 4 �, 205.13 C-1 LOCAL BUSINESS DISTRICT REGULATIONS 1. USES PERMITTED A. Principal Uses B. Accessory Uses C. Uses Permitted With a Special Use Permit. (7) Motor vehicle fuel and oil dispensing senrice as an accessory use to a convenience store. (a) The use shall not provide for the outdoor opera#ion of lubrication equipment, hydraulic lifts or service pits, or the outdoor display of merchandise. The display of petroleum products befinreen pumps, or the temporary display of inerchandise within four (� feet of the station building is permitted (this sentence to be deletedZ Ms. Daniels stated that temporary is not defined in the ordinance. This really allows permanent display in front of the stores. The display of petroleum products between the pumps is really from a bygone era. The proposed revision for the ordinance language is to keep the first part the same with no changes and to only delete the last sentence. Ms. Daniels stated that the more items out in the parking lot and by the service pumps, the more the sidewalk is blocked and people cannot get in and out. If something were � to happen in the store, people may have trouble getting out. Ms. Savage thanked Ms. Daniels for the presentation and asked if there were any questions. Mr. Oquist asked if the City was proposing a new ordinance in exchange for another ordinance. Ms. Daniels answered, No, but the proposed amendment to the ordinance would allow for temporary displays or sales. Temporary is defined in this case. A convenience store would be allowed the same temporary display as a C-2 District would have. The proposed deletion to the ordinance is taking out the sentence where temporary is not defined. Mr. Oquist stated that rather than deleting the sentence, temporary should possibly be defined. Ms. Daniels stated that it would be more of a redundant ordinance if they did that. Ten days would already be allowed. Mr. Oquist asked if convenience stores could display on the outside of the building on a temporary basis for ten days. � Ms. Daniels stated that is correct. � PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 5 Ms. Savage stated that it would eliminate the displays of pallets of pop and various � items. Ms. Daniels stated that the ordinance would eliminate that practice and they would have to store that inside the building, unless it was part of the temporary display that they applied for. Ms. Savage asked if anything could be displayed outside. Ms. Daniels stated that nothing could be displayed outside without a special use permit. Mr. Oquist asked how the convenience stores could display bundles of split wood. Ms. Daniels stated that it would be possible if it was temporary, but this ordinance would prevent them from storing it outside all winter. Mr. Kondrick asked for clarification regarding the permit application as to exactly how many items could be displayed. Could ten items be displayed? Ms. Daniels stated that the City would have to approve it and make sure where the ten items would be placed and the businesses could do this three times per year. Mr. Saba asked how this would impact businesses needing tent displays or auto dealers ^ with vehicles outside the building. Ms. Daniels stated that the special use permits allow that under permanent storage, and it still will be allowed. Mr. Saba asked if convenience stores could still display wood under a special use permit. Mr. Hickok stated that there are certain very specific provisions regarding unscreened outdoor display. Menards for example, had proposed a display of small accessory buildings by their store. This is an example where they have gone through a special use permit process. They had also historically had many things on their sidewalk. The City is very specific now to be able to state which things are allowed and in what area they are allowed. It is possible to go through in the C-3 District, for example, that same type of special use permit process. Home Depot and Wal-Mart went through a process to architecturally integrate with their building. This special use permit does not cause something that appears to be an afterthought, but instead they may have matching brick or rod iron to make it much more permanent. The special use permit would not allow the little garden center in the parking lot that is made up of concrete block with a split rail fence and taking out 40 parking stalls--unless they did it for ten days at a time, three times per year. ^ Ms. Savage asked for clarification regarding the temporary greenhouse applied for by Cub Foods. 7 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 6 Mr. Hickok stated that they have two options. They have what I'm sure they would view � as a disruptive method of setting it up for ten days and then taking it�all down, or Cub Foods in Apple Valley has to architecturally integrated its garden center area into a permanent area of the building. This option would exist in Fridley through the Special Use Permit process. Typically, it is not the parking lot but off from the side of the building in a nice enclosed area. What is garden center in the summer time is often Christmas tree sales in the winter. The City has not fully evaluated the letter by Cub Foods in Fridley; but unless Cub is willing to set it up and take it down on ten day increments, the garden center in the parking lot would not be able to happen. If they applied for a special use permit, the solution would be something much more permanent. An enclosed area, architecturally integrated into the building would be needed. Ms. Modig asked if this change would affect Petters Warehouse where they have a tent for their displays. Ms. Daniels stated that they are one of the businesses that would be affected by this ordinance. Ms. Modig asked how this ordinance would affect the annual Fridley garage sale. Mr. Hickok stated that that was on a piece of publicly zoned property at the ice arena. It is outside of the commercial districts being considered. That is under a different ^ process and takes City Council approval. Mr. Oquist asked how United Stores would be affected with their annual tent sale. Ms. Daniels stated that this ordinance would apply to them as well. Mr. Hickok stated that they could still do that for their ten-day sale. Ms. Savage asked if anyone in the audience wanted to address any concems. Ms. Sue Nelson, owner of Fridley Amoco, 7680 Highway 65, a C district store, stated that this ordinance affects businesses by regulating how they should look. Ms. Nelson stated that she and her husband, Mitch Nelson, are tire dealers. She feels it is unfair competition for them because they are not allowed to display their only product outside like auto dealers do. They are right across the street from another cifiy that has absolutely no regulations on its businesses for outside displays. She has no problem with a certain image but this ordinance has a direct impact to their business and to the economy. She hears comments from their customers that they should display more of their product outside. Ms. Savage asked if the tire displays were her main concem. ^ Ms. Nelson stated that they received numerous notices about removing their tires from the outside display, the latest notice stating that they would be taken to court if they did not remove the tires. Most tire stores use outdoor displays and more city stores are : PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 7 moving toward outdoor payment, for example, at the pump to pay for gas so they do not ��'� have to go into the store. The $75.00 fee to pay a few times a year only for ten days at a time is exactly what they did, but then they had problems getting their $250.00 deposit fee back. The process really did not flow that well. Ms. Savage asked if Staff had any response to Ms. Nelson. Mr. Hickok stated that they have seen convenience stores moving product outside. If salt is selling big for a retailer, then soon every retailer regionally would be selling salt outside. If cypress wood chips for your garden seem to be selling well, next thing you know, the entire metro area would be selling cypress wood chips outside. Firewood outside the door is another great example. It is an unfair advantage to retailers selling outside versus retailers who pay more roof overhead for selling product inside. It is unfortunate regarding the Nelson's business; but if tires are the product, then they need to have their own intemal warehouse space. Service bays typically have rolling cart with tires on them because when the doors are open, they roll those out to make room for the cars that go in to get tires put on there. It is a space demand issue. Though unfortunate, it looks like poor planning. From a safety perspective, it puts the product outdoors that can be stolen and puts a higher burden on the public safety folks. (Those carts may get in the way easier and not controlled very well). It may sound like a disadvantage to have this ordinance, but there are certain convenient advantages. Those sites glow at night and are able to have a lot of signage and opportunity to advertise things like tires. i''1 Ms. Nelson stated that they must pay for a sign permit and are only to be able to hang it in one spot to be visible from the canopy. She can only buy a permit twice a year and would like to hang the sign year round. Mr. Mitch Nelson, co-owner of Fridley Amoco, stated that he understands what the City is trying to do. He agrees with the idea of presentable businesses. They try to keep their business as presentable and nice as possible, and not to be in the way of anything. On the comer by their store, the comdor of the service road is very unsightly with extremely high grass. He feels the City should keep their landscaping presentable also. Ms. Modig asked exactly where his place of business is located. Mr. Nelson stated that it is on the comer of Osbome Road and Highway 65 by Spring Lake Park. Mr. Hickok stated that the median befinreen the service drive and Highway 65 is a State right-of-way. It is a jurisdictional issue. The City has tried to work with the state on that very issue. The City has put additional funds in their budget to take care of corridor maintenance. The State's image and mowing characteristics are not the same as the City's. The City does not believe that two times per year is adequate. � Mr. Sielaff asked Mr. Hickok if Spring Lake Park was being mowed more frequently. 0 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 8 Mr. Hickok stated that sometimes the businesses themselves take care of mowing right r"'�, out to the roadway because they do believe it is an image issue for themselves. He cannot speak for that Spring Lake Park example. Many businesses in Fridley mow out to the State right-of-way. Mr. Hickok is not advocating that because of the OSHA requirements. Mr. John Thompson, Store Manager for Fridley Cub Foods, stated that he has some concems also. It would not be very cost effective for Fridley Cub Foods to put up a greenhouse for ten days and then tear it down. He was wondering if there could be some seasonal type language that would allow for a seasonal promotion for 45 - 60 days. This would allow for firewood to be out in the winter at gas stations and would allow Cub to have a summer greenhouse. To his knowledge, Fridley would be the only Cub Foods store that is not allowed to have a greenhouse in the parking lot. He does not think they are gaudy greenhouses. They have a split rail fence and are professionally done. Ms. Modig asked Mr. Hickok if the greenhouse would be classified under the special use permit. Mr. Hickok stated that it would be covered under the special use permit. He wanted to encourage Mr. Thompson to look at the Apple Valley Garden Center at the Cub Foods there. That is an excellent example of where the garden center has been architecturally integrated into the site plan. It does not take parking stalls critical to the site. One of � the things about the Holiday site in Fridley is that it would be hard to pick parking stalls that are not utilized. That is a very well utilized parking lot. Typically, what happens with the split rail fence in the garden center is that it goes up where the customers are and displaces parking for customers. Staff would be happy to talk with Cub and evaluate their site plan and talk about what would be likely stipulations in a special use permit. There is only so much landscape dollar to go around. Mr. Hickok stated there are already a Bachman's, Lyndale Garden Center, and Home Depot in Fridley. They have made the investment to architecturally integrate their garden center into their sites. To temporarily put up split rail fence in the parking lot takes some of the regional landscape dollar away from those places that are paying taxes on a permanent improvement year round and is unfair competition. Unless there is an improvement equivalent to the architectural quality seen in other places with permanent characteristic that allows circulation around it, then it is a dismal future. He has not heard the support for that type of thing with other requests. Ms. Savage asked if the Wal-Mart addition was permanent. Mr. Hickok stated that is an excellent example. This is the third time that Wal-Mart has expanded their garden center and needed a new special use permit to do that. They are doing it architecturally and permanently on their site. It does not contrast and has proper circulation. �, Ms. Savage stated that she would recommend that Mr. Thompson work with staff to go over the exact requirements for a special use permit. 10 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 9 � Mr. Thompson stated that he would have to upgrade the facility to accommodate a greenhouse. The building is 30 years old. They have already put hundreds of thousands of dollars to upgrade the parking lot. He feels that down the road there may be a chance to make something similar to Apple Valley's store. He worked there up until three years ago, but all of the other Cub Foods stores are allowed to do this and he was wondering why the Fridley store cannot. He understands the concerns with the appearance and parking. He feels there may be space available between Cub and the gas station for a greenhouse. He stated that he appreciated the Planning Commission's time. Ms. Savage asked for clarification regarding the Target greenhouse. Mr. Hickok stated that the Target greenhouse has a special use permit from an era that predates the City's current requirements. Ms. Leigh Hams, President of Anoka County Chamber of Commerce, stated that this is an issue they have been contacted about. There are three issues. One is regarding the outdoor temporary display. She wanted to thank the Fridley staff for putting together the amendment that does allow for that being less restrictive. She hears frustration from the business community. She wants the Commission to consider that they are competing with the communities that are directly surrounding Fridley. She feels that Fridley should be treating the business communifiy as competitively as the surrounding ,.-� communities. She feels that the businesses in Fridley are not afraid of competition. The cost of using something only four months out of the year will not allow businesses to price their product competitively. There are at least 50 businesses that have the same concems regarding these issues. Some have picked up their business and moved because they feel Fridley is too restrictive, and they were not able to compete on an even playing field. She feels the business community is very respectable and they care about the aesthetic quality of the community. She would love to have the opportunity to have some more dialogue meetings with the businesses to address more issues. She wants the City of Fridley to realize how they compare with other communities. Ms. Diane Wright at Chopper City Sports, Fridley, stated that she had a question regarding United Store's tent sale having it all on the grass and how this policy would change that. Mr. Oquist stated that the sale is allowed only for ten days. Ms. Wright asked for clarification regarding the sale being on a non-landscaped area. Mr. Oquist stated that they do have it on a landscaped area. Ms. Daniels stated that this ordinance would not allow anything to be displayed on the ,,..� landscaped areas. 11 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 10 Mr. Hickok stated that if they were to modify the sale to allow the tents on the slabbed � area around, it would be an example of how they could conduct the sale. It may restrict the number of tents. Mr. Oquist stated that when you put tents on grass, it makes for a good display area. Ms. Wright stated that they have a small landscaped area with rocks where they display their items. Ms. Daniels stated that they have a special use permit for the permanent display in front of the building and this would not be affected. Ms. Wright brought some pictures of businesses around them in a finro block radius that have product stacked way above their fences. Mr. Hickok stated that this is an ordinance for the commercial districts only. The pictures Ms. Wright brought in are of industrial districts. They are pre-existing and non- conforming that have screening issues outdoors. Staff is talking with one of them for removal of items to improve their image. Mr. Hickok stated that the consideration this evening would allow additional things outside for Chopper City Sports. This ordinance does not affect the issues behind their building with storage of their sleds (snowmobiles). The special use permit they have is ,�-� specific saying that no storage would happen in view of the public above the screening fence. MOTION by Mr. Kondrick, seconded by Ms. Modig, to close the public hearing. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE, CHAIRPERSON SAVAGE DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED AND THE PUBLIC HEARING WAS CLOSED AT 8:29 P.M. Mr. Hickok stated that there will be a first and second reading by the Council on November 22, and any members of the public are welcome to attend the meeting and voice any concems. Ms. Savage stated that she is in favor of eliminating the cluttered look of outdoor displays. She feels that it is a good idea for business to have a permanent addition that fits in architecturally with the design of the building. She would like to see that happen with Cub Foods in Fridley with a very nice addition. She is generally in favor of the ordinance. Ms. Modig asked Mr. Hickok for clarification with the ten days temporary use permit with Section E. She asked if they could get an extension on the ten days. She stated that basically she is in favor of this ordinance and does not like to see clutter either. ,.� Mr. Hickok stated that the City would enforce these conditions under the licensing process. When an application comes in, there would be insistence that the sale be ten days only and also an inspection would be required. The $75.00 fee covers the 12 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 11 inspection cost for the 11 �' day to make sure the sale was not still going on. If the � Commission feels that ten days is inappropriate, they can tell the Council how many days they feel are appropriate. He feels enforcement is such an important thing and wants the Commission to make sure they want exceptions. Long-range outdoor opportunity is available through the special use permit process. Ms. Modig stated that it seems that some things are falling in the cracks. Some products do not fall into these categories. There are service type buildings that are not built space-wise to accommodate all items. Mr. Oquist stated that he agrees with Ms. Modig. There are a lot of little businesses in Fridley that do not have the outdoor storage. There are certain reasons that some things should not be stored inside, for example, wood because of the insects. He feels they should be careful of the ordinance that shuts out competition. Mr. Saba stated he agreed. He stated the City of Mankato allows 20% of property to be used. He feels they could have percentage applied toward small businesses and have a specific area for outdoor displays without having to go through the licensing process. This ordinance is too restrictive for small businesses. Cub Foods has done great things with their landscaping; they do not feel they would have anything not presentable in front of their store for a garden center. There are different situations for different size businesses and he would be opposed to the amendment the way it is written. � Mr. Kondrick stated that he feels it is the smaller businesses that are really effected by this ordinance and there should be another way around this. This is geared toward the larger businesses. He feels it is a good idea to improve the aesthetics of Fridley. He wants the businesses to stay and that is his primary concem. He would oppose this amendment. Ms. Savage asked for clarification of what allows the small convenience stores to display items outdoor. Ms. Daniels stated that the proposed deletion part of the ordinance allows that with temporary not being defined. Mr. Saba stated that this is too restrictive and they should define separate ordinances for small businesses and look at the seasonal aspect. Mr. Sielaff stated that they should be careful when making differentiation befinreen large and small businesses. He wants to see a certain amount of consistency and to be fair. It is more important to regulate the volume of product a business wants to display outside. Mr. Kondrick stated that he agrees with what Mr. Saba stated about the percentage idea for small businesses. In Mankato, there is differentiation befinreen the sizes of ,,..,� businesses and what they can have out. 13 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 12 Mr. Sielaff stated that he is all for restrictions but does not want to make it too restrictive ,�"� and have too much differentiation befinreen large and small businesses. � Ms. Modig asked how long it took for the City to ask Wal-Mart to integrate the greenhouse into their site. Mr. Hickok stated that Wal-Mart came to town in 1993. They applied for their special use permit immediately for the garden center. The first year they utilized all of their outdoor garden center space plus they did their parking lot garden center without asking the City. To avoid shutting a new business down for that season, the City allowed them to continue to sell that season only. The next year they had to expand their garden center or not sell in the parking lot. Ms. Savage stated that she thought they should also consider the ten day part of it. That does apply in certain situations. Ms. Modig stated she agrees but there has to be something to cover the every day product sales. There is too wide an umbrella, and this does not cover the small and large business special sales. Mr. Sielaff stated that he does not want to get into the seasonal business. He thinks the ordinance should just restrict a certain percentage on what they use on a seasonal basis. Ms. Dacy stated that the majority of businesses in Fridley are very good at their aesthetic appearance. There are violations out there, and they need to address the impact of outdoor display without the proper controls. There are two parts to the ordinance. Right now, aside from a convenience store or gas station, Petters Warehouse or the businesses across the street, cannot have any temporary outdoor display at all. The ordinance is providing a business with an additional option. The second part does deal with convenience stores and gas stations. Garden centers are listed separately with a special use permit. Through that process, the City has been more aggressive with outdoor sales. It is typical for cities to react to a transient marketplace. There are separate issues that the ordinance is providing the means to control. Ms. Savage stated that it looks like the Commission is in agreement with the ten day temporary part of the ordinance for outdoor sales. Mr. Oquist stated that he is still confused with the ordinances and does not necessarily agree with what Ms. Dacy stated. All of this ordinance states that you cannot store items outside. He feels the ordinance is not written clear enough. Ms. Dacy stated that the ordinance is adding a new section allowing temporary outdoor sales. It deletes an existing sentence ln the ordinance that permits the temporary ,...1 display of petroleum-related products. Mr. Sielaff asked for clarification regarding long-term storage outside. 14 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 13 ;� Ms. Dacy stated that there is a special use permit for garden centers and outdoor display of inerchandise. There is a special use permit for car sales. Mr. Oquist asked Ms. Dacy if a gas station wanted to display wood bundles or tires, would they have to get a special use permit and be charged for that every season? Ms. Dacy stated that is correct. Mr. Oquist stated that he does not agree with that. Maybe the problem is what they want to delete out of this ordinance. There is nothing wrong with the ten day ordinance, but they have to be careful with the other one. Ms. Savage stated she thought the confusion is that the ordinance permits what it calls temporary display, but it does not define temporary. Presumably that part of the current ordinance allows convenience stores to put the salt product outside without the special use permit. Ms. Savage stated that maybe they could have it re-examined to see whether there could be some restrictions placed on display of inerchandise outside the store without a special use permit. Mr. Hickok stated that they would not have to get a special use permit every time they ^ wanted to display something outside. Mr. Oquist stated that rather than to delete the sentence, they could come up with a way to handle the small businesses and allow them to display some of their merchandise outside. Ms. Savage stated that she felt there needs to be some more discussion also with staff and the Chamber of Commerce before there are changes made. Mr. Sielaff stated that to summarize, they are saying that they want to have some restrictions so there is not a special use permit needed at some point. Ms. Savage stated she believes that is something that needs to be discussed. Mr. Sielaff asked whether United Stores tent sale would classify under the ten day permit. Mr. Oquist stated that would be restricted by paragraph F. Mr. Saba stated that he felt they should reword that. Mr. Hickok stated that he would caution Commissioners to not include displays on the ^ boulevard area. There are a lot of safety reasons to not do that. That is also called the public right-of-way. 15 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 14 Mr. Hickok summarized that the Commission is okay with the ten day part of the ��"�, ordinance. The Commission is not okay with striking existing code language without further discussion. The Commission is not sending a recommendation onto the City Council but instead giving Staff instruction to go back and work on that piece and then come back with the ten day and also the deleted language in a modified form and leave special use permits untouched as an option for long-term outdoor display. Ms. Savage asked if it should move on to City Council or should the Planning Commission look at it again. Mr. Hickok stated that they probably would be best off to table it and hold open the decision until it comes back in a modified form. MOTION by Mr. Sielaff, seconded by Ms. Modig, to table the Zoning Text Amendment, ZTA #99-02. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE, CHAIRPERSON SAVAGE DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. Ms. Savage stated that this would be removed from the City Council agenda. Ms. Nelson stated that she wanted to add that the language to delete regarding the four feet perimeter is not going to be enough help. Their permit was denied until they � remove the product from the four feet perimeter which is the current allotment. Mr. Hickok stated that the recommended ten day outdoor sale opportunity three times per year is new. They are not entitled to do the sale right now. The outdoor storage on a permanent basis was set up as an outdoor display on a permanent basis and is not permitted currently. It is a special use permit requirement. They would have needed a special use permit to have the tires outside or agree that they would do it on a very temporary basis. Our observation has been that it is essential that Nelson's pull their tires out of the stall to do their business. It is not a temporary thing and would require a special use permit. 2, COMPREHENSIVE PLAN DISCUSSION: Ms. Dacy stated that the Commission has a first draft of a part of the plan. Brad Scheib, employee of the Hoisington Koegler Group, Inc., prepared much of the draft and consultation with Staff. She wanted to review what the City has done so far and what the City is hoping to do in the next six to eight months. Two years ago, the City had planning area meetings by dividing the City into seven areas and sent a letter to every household and had an open forum. There were written surveys, and they got tremendous information out of the process. A year ago last September, the Planning Commission reviewed the vision statement and guiding principles that the consultant proposed. �^� Ms. Dacy stated that the consultant has gathered a lot of information about the housing market. There has been a land use analysis about what has been developed and 16 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 15 undeveloped. That will continue as they go through the process. A GIS consultant i"� developed maps and the City will be distributing plan drafts to the all of the Commissions. Ms. Dacy stated that on November 8, they will kick off the process with a proclamation by the City Council on Monday to declare November 8 World Town Planning Day. That is a promotion being done by the American Planning Association and the Wor�d Town Institute in Europe to heighten the awareness of the importance of planning in the communities today. They are also planning an open house on November 18. They will invite back the vision participants and share the plan draft and receive feedback. More of the chapters will be accomplished by that time. Tentatively they are thinking the first official public hearing on the plan will be at one of the December meetings. Ms. Dacy stated a goal is to submit a draft to Met Council by the end of this year. The City has received a year extension at this point in time. All of the Cities in the metropolitan area are doing this process. State law requires that communities share their comprehensive plans. After they submit the draft to Met Council, there will probably be a number of changes as they move through the process. Sometime in the year 2000, probably the first four months, there will be a second official public hearing with the Planning Commission. In between that time, the Commission will be kept up to date as to how they are progressing. When Met Council signs, a resolution will be presented to the Council to approve the comprehensive plan. The product you will see is a notebook with all of the text in it and a publication of an executive summary which � they would like to send to every household and business in the community. Ms. Dacy stated that the plan will address the Community Vision Chapter, Land Use and Housing and Plan Overview. They have yet to do the preface which explains the process and the State requirements. They are working on a draft of the Parks and Open Space Chapter, Sewer and Water Services, Transportation, Storm Issues, and Human Resources is an optional element, but they do intend to include that, and of course implementation. The time line is 20 years. Met Council does its population, household, and employment projections that far out. Ms. Dacy stated that there is a very strong movement across the country to contain sprawl. Growth is beginning to jump out into areas that do not have sewer senrice or proper urban types of services to the detriment of the central city and the communities surrounding it. The Met Council sees Fridley as a first ring suburb just outside the central cities and within the urban service area and almost fully developed. Met Council wants to encourage as much investment and redevelopment as possible within that urban service area before people start moving out to the outer communities and building on a five acre lot with a septic system. They are projecting the region to grow by 300,000 households in 20 years. Ms. Dacy stated Fridley is projected to hold fairly steady, presently 28,600 people. In the year 2010 it is projected to hold at about 29,000. The City needs to decide how ,._.� aggressive they want to be in adding new housing or businesses. Some of it might happen without the City's control. Medtronic will generate a lot of interest from the business community and potentially another type of housing market. They need to be 17 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 16 prepared to respond. Fridley is 50 years old this year and grew up in the automobile ,� era and suburban movement. For the next 20 years, Fridley is going to be changing more toward urban. They are almost fully developed and have some of the traditional issues associated with urban development such as strip malls and large parking lots. Ms. Dacy stated that in the document, they have tried to make a strong connection between what the vision process said and try to translate that into what they want to accomplish. The issues identified are probably something everyone can agree on. They want to improve their image and maintain the housing stock. The debate is how to get there. What are the strategies to implement what they want to accomplish with those goals? Ms. Dacy stated that the vision statement refers to Fridley as being a diverse and well balanced community with small town types of qualities. They derive the sense of community from the different types of elements that define the heritage. The vision statement says that: "We want to maintain and promote a friendly atmosphere." Fridley is wonderFully poised in a convenient location in the metropolitan area. They do offer a high quality environment to the residents and the businesses and want to see that maintained. They want to continue with an aggressive housing program and work on a creative transportation system. There are three very well traveled corridors and highways and traffic will increase. They want to create a distinctive image. Medtronic will probably spur a lot of interest in doing that. Medtronic is very concemed about the image created in new developments. ,�, Ms. Dacy stated that they need the Commission's feedback on the list of key issues. The plan identified a number of community image issues relating to what happens as a result of the Medtronic Corporate Campus. The housing analysis shows that there is a need for move-up housing. The vision meetings were clear in that they wanted us to continue in maintaining the housing stock and economic stability. The tax base is wonderful to retain businesses. There are traffic issues on the horizon, and they need to look at transit altematives. Bikeway, walkways and park and recreation needs are also important for leisure altematives. Retail uses are important to look at also. There are only one or two undeveloped commercially zoned lots. The river area for redevelopment area is an important issue to look at also. Ms. Dacy stated that the Commission does have a lot of detail work to do. They need to count acres, fill in the blanks, and look at future land use to make a recommendation to the Council. They have to work on the strategies, not just the goals and policies. Future meetings will probably have some of the items on the comprehensive plan. The Commission will have to review additional chapters. Mr. Saba stated they have to be very careful with what they do with their green spaces. He feels they should be enhanced and not developed necessarily without a very good plan. The green spaces are a very big part of the quality of life in Fridley and are very well used. �� Ms. Savage stated that she felt the very best part of Fridley is the park. That is what makes Fridley extremely livable. The shift from suburban to urban is a tendency that : PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 17 Fridley has. She feels that people would rather walk to a gathering place. She would ,�, like to see more walkways and bikeways and good transportation so people do not have to rely on their cars. Increasing traffic congestion is a problem that should be addressed. � Mr. Saba stated they do have some areas along the river, and he is not sure if they should do a lot of development there because it is mostly residential. He feels they should enhance the park land they have. Mr. Oquist stated that he does not associate the river with Fridley. It is very dangerous. Ms. Savage stated they could improve the park area near the river that they already have. There is not that much of that area where they can ride a bike or walk by the river. Mr. Saba stated that the biking and hiking and the ability to walk across the City is a value to have adversity in the landscape. Mr. Kondrick stated that he feels that Fridley is a very convenient place to live. He feels it is an advantage as the population grows. He can see that some things are now happening to make Fridley a beautiful place to live in. The traific problem is a concem. Mr. Oquist stated that University Avenue is very hard to drive on in rush hour. Mr. Kondrick stated that as time goes on, with the traffic problem, people might say they want to live in Fridley but they cannot very easily drive there because of the traffic congestion. Mr. Oquist stated that Fridley is attractive and convenient. Fridley is also getting to be an older community. As the people move out, we want the younger folks to move in and want to maintain the school district and housing stock. People want to move out to the five acre lots because they want to be away from the closeness. They may need more than one central gathering place. Mr. Sielaff stated that one of the greatest resources in Fridley is the people. What sort of things can they do as a community for self-improvement such as education and recreation is an issue. There is a shortage of facilities in Fridley. The City and the school district did some good things with the basketball court but there is still strain. There is a payback for more education and recreation such as education for the homeowners so the City can have better kept-up houses. Ms. Savage stated that she would like to see an expanded community center similar to the ones in Maple Grove and New Brighton. Ms. Modig stated that she feels that there are a lot of things that are not conducive to ^ keeping senior citizens in Fridley. There are not a lot of housing opportunities for senior citizens for one-level housing type that has some space to it. The Rottlund homes do not have any three bedrooms. 19 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 18 '`'r Mr. Kondrick stated that maybe they could have more Christenson Crossing type developments in Fridley. Ms. Modig stated that the land area is not there. Some of those housing developments are out there but they are located next to something like a car lot. Ms. Dacy stated that the City has been meeting an hour a day with the comprehensive plan trying to think futuristically. They are running out of vacant land to start brand new, but there are a lot of underutilized areas that may require acquisitions. Now that there are two Metronic campuses flanking Central Avenue, Central Avenue may change a lot. The ramblers are currently at a sale price that attracts the younger types of families. Mr. Oquist stated that maybe they should start reviewing their ordinances that will allow some of the development. Maybe the City will have to get creative and not have the ordinances to have so much green space to be able to build certain complexes. Ms. Dacy stated the ordinance setback for single family homes may be changed to relax the front yard requirement. The mother-in-law apartment may be an addition on to the rear of the home that avoids the stairs. Mr. Saba stated that there are more changes with shopping on the web, and you may not see a lot of usage for the big malls anymore. It saves people trips to the malls and in ,� that light they should plan for the impact of technology. Transportation systems might have to be re-evaluated. More people are working in their homes and work via e-mail and the web. The enhancement to the Springbrook Nature Center for a garden area at the entrance is also being talked about. A small amphitheater may be possible too. Mr. Kondrick stated that the Riverview Heights area has been turr�ed into a cute, sharp area. It is just amazing how the streets, curb and gutter has changed the whole area. Mr. Sielaff stated that there are some issues with technology that need to be looked at. There is now cable N with a debate going on nationally with high speed Intemet access and who is going to own the cable lines. This may affect the cable franchise in Fridley. As a City, what things could they provide over the Intemet, and there are a lot of opportunities for education. Ms. Dacy stated that at the next meeting, the proje�t to be discussed is the North Star Rail Line from downtown Minneapolis to St. Cloud on the existing railroad tracks. They are evaluating a station stop in Fridley at both the east and west side of the tracks at 61 St Avenue. They have another presentation at the next meeting on November 17 about the Nature Center. Staff will also make a presentation about the North Star Corridor. Mr. Kondrick asked if they were talking about putting in a third track. r--� Ms. Dacy stated that they would use the existing tracks that are there now for the northbound and southbound peak hour of service. Anoka County staff advised her if it 20 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 19 does become a reality in the year 2002, that probably from a funding point of view, an i"� LRT route through Fridley to Northtown as planned may be placed several years out in the future. This gets the funding and has a strong backing by Mr. Oberstar. In January or February of 2000, the City will be coming back to them with some recommendations about that park-and-ride site and how it should be handled. � Mr. Kondrick stated that the rail from downtown to the Mall of America started out to be a$400,000,000 deal and now it is a$548,000,000 in just two years time. That makes him nervous and he feels money is not being very well spent. Mr. Sielaff stated that they would not even consider anything north until the thing with the Mall of America has been decided. Ms. Dacy stated that that is the first priority because it has the highest ridership projections. Ms. Savage stated that the arts in Fridley are very important in getting the community together. Fridley does not have a single bookstore. She would like to see a Bames and Noble type format with a coffee shop inside. A concert hall would be nice. Mr. Oquist stated that the use of their business community to help them develop some of these things should be considered as to what can they do to help in some of these areas. Mr. Sielaff asked if part of the discussions of traffic in the area was talking about not necessarily increasing the width of highways and additional lanes. They would try to encourage people to live around near where they work. That may be something they have to look at as to how they could do that. Medtronic has an increase in the number of employees and what are the ramifications. Ms. Dacy stated that some of that may fuel move-up housing demand. Only about ten percent (10%) of the employees in Fridley live in Fridley. Mr. Oquist stated that one of the issues with Medtronic are that these are high-tech people making high-tech money and it is not possible to build many new homes at a higher price range in Fridley. Ms. Dacy stated that they need to start thinking of going up with the buildings and reduced acreage in Fridley rather than one-stories to make more uses. Mr. Sielaff asked if the draft the Commission received was the beginning of the comprehensive plan. Ms. Dacy stated, yes. The Commission will receive a Parks and Open Space chapter, a Transportation chapter, a Sewer and Water chapter, Storm chapter, and then there will ^ be a discussion on implementation about some of the ideas on the plan as well. 21 PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, NOVEMBER 3, 1999 PAGE 20 /"� ADJOURNMENT: MOTION by Mr. Kondrick, seconded by Mr. Oquist, to adjoum the meeting. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE, CHAIRPERSON SAVAGE DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED AND THE NOVEMBER 3, 1999, PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING ADJOURNED AT 10:10 P.M. Respectfully submitted, � � � �� Signe Johnson Recording Secretary n � 22