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PR 09/26/1983 - 31290CITY OF FRIDLEY PARKS & RECREATION COMMISSION MEETING SEPTEMBER 26, 1983 '' CALL TO ORDER; Chairperson Kondrick called the September 26, 1983, Parks & Recreation Commission meeting to order at 7:45 p.m. ROLL CALL: Members Present: Dave Kondrick, Jan Seeger, Dan Allen, Dick Young . Members Absent: Mary Schreiner Others Present: Charles Boudreau, Parks 8 Recreation Director Jack Kirk, Recreation Supervisor Jerry Nelson, 7428 Concerto Curve Barbara Hughes, 548 Rice Creek Terrace N.E. APPROVAL OF JULY 25, 1983, PARKS b RECREATION COMMISSION MINUTES: � MOTION BY MR. ALLEN, SECONDED BY JHR. YOUNG, TO APPRDVE TXE JULY 25� 1983� �- PARKS 6 RECREATIDN COMMISSION 1NINUTES AS WRITTEN. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE, CHAIRPERSON KONDRICR DECLARED THE MOTION CARRZED UNANIMOUSLY. � APPROVAL OF AGENDA: MOTION BY MR. YOUNG� SECONDED BY MS. SEEGER, TO APPROVE-TAE AGENDA AND TO PUT TXE REQUEST FOR HOCKEY RINK POLICY BY JERRY NELSON AS TH£ FIRST ITEM ON TXE AGENDA. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE� CHAIRPERSON KONDRICK DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIJNOUSLY. 1. REQUEST FOR HOCKEY RINK POLICY - JERRY NELSON Dr. Boudreau stated the Conanission members had received a copy of a letter from Jerry Nelson requesting the City have a policy that anyone under age 21 on a rink with a hockey stick must wear a helmet. Mr. Kondrick stated the one problem he could see with having a policy would be the enforcement of it. Dr. Boudreau stated this subject of requiring helmets for hockey came up about ^ 3-4 years ago. At that time, the Comnission did not feel they were in_any position to require the general public to wear certain equipment when they were `� on the hockey rinks. P�RKS b RECREATION COMMISSION MEETING SEPTEMBER 26 1983 PAGE 2 Ms. Seeger stated it was difficult for the Commission to figure out how they would enforce such a policy. One thing the Commission could possibly do is strongly advise or post a sign that helmets are recomnended. Or. Boudreau stated he would have no problem with a recommendation. Mr. Nelson stated he knew there would be a problem with policing a policy like this. Nowever, there are rules that no one is allowed on an open skating area with a hockey stick. The rink attendant enforces that rule, and there doesn't seem to be a problem. At Columbia Arena and other indoor rinks, it is just accepted that if you are on the rink with a hockey stick, you must also wear a helmet. Mr. Nelson stated there were two really bad accidents last year at Madsen Park that could have been avoided if the players had been wearing helmets. He felt the kids not playing hockey are the ones most likely to get hurt. Mr. Nelson stated that 80-90% of the kids on the rinks are hockey players. He stated he lives in School District 16. He has talked to J. McCluskey who is going to talk to the Spring Lake Park City Council about having a bunch of helmets laying around at the rinks so the kid that comes without one would have a helmet to wear. He stated that when a non-hockey player is paying �10-15 for a stick, he did not be]ieve �20 for a helmet was unreasonable, and it protects the face and the head. Also, helmets can of ten be bought very reasonably in garage sales. Mr. Young stated he thought that most of the hockey p7aying on the skating areas was on the rinks that were lighted. Could a warming house attendant enforce a helmet policy? Dr. Boudreau stated that the big question would be, how far does the city �o? If they require a helmet, what about other protective equipment? They don't want to see any kind of injury. He stated he would like to see the parents take the responsibility to make sure their children wear protective equipment. Mr.l�lson stated he felt a lot of parents really don't understand what is going on at the rinks, and they don't understand the differences in ages of the children playing hockey. He stated that any association in the state of Minnesota requires full equipment for any organized practice or game. He stated hockey has a bad enough name already,and he did not like to see kids get hurt when they could give a policy like this a try. Mr. Kondrick stated maybe there should be a sign recommending that hockey helmets be worn. Ms. Seeger stated she did not think the City could do anything other than strongly recommend that protective equipment be worn. She would feel better- i f i t was pos ted. � PARKS b RECREATION COMMISSION MEETI��G, SEPTEMBER 26, 1983 PAGE 3 Or. Boudreau stated he thought they are talking a difference in age groups. When there is a 16-17 yr. old warming house attendant trying to tell an 18 yr. old he has io wear a helmet, there cou7d be problems. Then the rule is non-effective. The younger kids see the older ones not following the rule, and they are going to question why they have to follow the rule. He did not think they could have a double standard. And, he did not think a city body could put a rule on head gear on an outside public use area. He stated he would 7ike to check with the City Attorney to see where the City stood legally. With an indoor faci7ity where ice time is being paid for, there is the price of admission and the facility can set the rules. Mr. Kondrick stated he liked the idea of the kids wearing helmets. He �ould like Dr. Boudreau to check with the City Attorney to see what the City could or could not do. If nothing else, they should try a sign recommending that helmets be worn. Mr. Young stated he felt the same way. He felt they have a moral obligation : to the people who use the rinks. He could see Dr. Boudreau's point about other protective equipment, but most other injuries to the body heal. You cannot replace the sight of an eye, and brain concussions can cause epilepsy or mental retardation or other kinds of permanent injuries. Mr. Allen stated he had mixed emotions about this issue. There was definitely �^ a difference between the indoor ice facility and the general outside facility. — He doubted that a 16 yr, old was supervising at Columbia Arena. He was also concerned about where do they start and where do they stop. Personally, he had far more injuries playing pick-up football than he ever did playing hockey. He did not think a strong recomnendation on a sign was worth anything. Most kids don't care about what a sign says. But, maybe they should have the restriction and try it on an experimental basis. Ms. Seeger stated she was not so much concerned about enforcing as informing. MOTION BY l�t. ALLEN� SECONDED BY l�II2. YDUNG, TfIAT DR. BOUDREAU CHECK WITH THE CITY ATTORNEY TO SEE WHETHER A MANDATORY HELMET RULE WAS POSSIBLE AND TO BRING BACK A REPORT TO TXE COMMISSION AT THEIR OCTOBER MEETING. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VDTING AYE� CHAIRPERSON KONDRICK DECLARED TXE MOTION GARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. Mr. Allen suggested that Dr. Boudreau check with adjoining communities to see if any other communities are doing anything like this. Another suggestion would be to inform parents through the city newsletter about the accidents that have happened and stressing the importance of wearing protective equipment when playing hockey. Mr. Nelson stated that he knows other communities do not require helmets but, no matter what other comnunities are doing, somebody has to be first. � � PARKS b RECREATION COMMISSION MEETING, SEPTEM6ER 26, 1983 _ PAGE 4 2. DIRECTOR'S REPORT: a. State Fair Nature Exhibit Dr. Boudreau stated at the State Fair. is doing. � that once again, Springbrook had an excellent exhibit He stated he is very proud of what the nature center Dr. Boudreau stated he would like to announce Springbrook's anniversary celebration on Oct. 8, the same Saturday as the grand opening of the plaza and the community park. Dr. Boudreau stated the Nature Center has come out with a 32-page coloring book for children. Mary Ellen Schutz, Parks & Recreation Dept. staff,did tf�e art work and put together the book which will be offered for sale at $1 per book. They hope to recapture some of the cost of printing and so they can keep reprinting as the need arises. They think the coloring book might be a big winner with some of the school systems who bring children out to the Nature Center. He stated the book is both entertaining and educational. b. Comnons Park Rehab Plan Dr. Boudrea!� si�ted Mr. Qureshi had received a memo from Councilman Schneider suggesting that the Parks & Recreation Dept, had a plan for Commons Park that wasn't being shared with everyone. Dr. Boudreau stated the Commission members knew that the discussion has always been that they would like to eliminate Fields #3 and #4 and develop that north end of the park into a more passive type of city park. That is the only plan they have to date. He would like to have some input from the Commission members, because he would 1Tke to have a firm plan for that development by the middle of December so they can go in next spring and do some work on it. He felt it was essential, if they are going to change that end of the park and make it a passive use area, to remove the ball diamonds before spring. He stated they�do have some funding for � piantings�and�trees in that area. � - . Dr. Boudreau asked the Comnission members to give this thought and give him some ideas of what they would like to see in this area. Mr. Young stated one thing he felt there was a need for in the City was a wading pool for the younger children. He knew it was an expenditure, but maybe the Jaycees or another organization would be willing to make an ongoing commitment for something like that. He thought some type of ampitheater/bandshell structure would be appropriate. He would like to see some landscaping with small hills that would break up the flat area. � � Mr. Allen stated he thought one thing they should do is go back to the � neighborhood and see what the neighborhood would like to see in their - park. He thought it might be very worthwhile to get the neighborhood input. � PARKS $ RECREATION COMMISSION_MEETING, SEPTEMBER 26, 1983 PAGE 5 Dr. Boudreau stated that was a very good suggestions, and he would be happy to do that. c. Fall Progrart� Mr. Kirk stated the fall programming had started that day. He stated registration was very good in the physical fitness area. d. Plaza/Corrmunity Park Grand Opening Dr. Boudreau gave the Commission members a copy of a news release which outlined the schedule for the grand opening of the Fridley Community Park and Plaza on Oct. 7 and 8. He invited the Comnission members to come to the grand opening of both the plaza and community park and to also visit Springbrook's anniversary celebration. 3. NEW BUSINESS: a. Playground Area at Rice Creek School Dr. Boudreau stated that at the last City Counci] meeting, there was a group from Rice Creek area wanting to know what was going to happen to � the hockey rink/tennis court/playground area if Rice Creek School is sold. He stated he thought the Parks & Recreation Comnission should become �� � involved in what is really needed in this area, what the minimum needs are that should be retained if the school is sold, or the position the Commission wants to take on the possibility of losing the playground facilities they now have at Rice Creek School. Or. Soudreau stated the school�property takes up about 10 acres. There is playground equipment behind the school� a lighted hockey rink and tennis court area on the south side of the school, and a small open ballfield area on the south side of the school. In the past, the City has used the gymnasium and the school facilities for summer playground programs. He stated the school and playground equipment take up about 5 acres. . Mr. Young stated he would like to know the demographic figures for this area. Dr. Boudreau stated the next closest park is Benjamin/Briardale Park, and that is across Mississippi St. They are talking about 2500-3500 people in this neighborhood. In looking at the National Park & Recreation Assoc. minimum requirements for a neighborhood park, it is 2.5 acres to 5 acres or about 1 acre/1,000 people. With 2500-3500 people in the surrounding neighborhood, there should be a minimum of 2=1/2-3 acres for park area. Dr. Boudreau stated he would like the Comnission members to give this � thought and be prepared to �iscuss this at the�October meeting. PARKS & RECREATION COMMISSION MEETING z SEPTEMBER 26, 1983 ___ PAGE 6 ^ Mr. Young stated it might be necessary to have a special meeting on this within the next month. Mr. Kondrick stated he would talk to Joe Lapinski of the School Board about this matter and try to determine the present status and thoughts. 4. OLD BUSINESS: a. Policy - Community Park Complex Tournament Use Dr. Boudreau stated the Commission members had a copy of a letter from John Gargaro, President of the Fridley 49'ers, requesting the Community Park ball fields for a slo-pitch tournament the week of 49'er Days, June 15, 16, and 17, 1984. He stated this is the first official request the City has received, but they are anticipating many requests in the future. He stated the Commission needs to establish some type of policy for use of the new complex for softball tournaments. Dr. Boudreau stated that he and Mr. Kirk have discussed this and are suggesting that any profit-making group or organization having a tournament for its own profit should be charged $1,000 for a weekend. They haven't made any decisions regarding concessions. There would have to be some stipulation on cost sharing with the City. He stated they are suggesting charging �500 for non-profit organizations for a weekend tournament. ,.� Dr. Boudreau stated they have estimated it will cost the City approx. �15/hr. per field to have the lights on for softball. For four fields, that is $60/hr. for lighting . They are figuring $42O.for m intenance people• They felt the $1,000 would include the light�ng an� the maintenance of the fields. He gave the Commission members a copy of the Municipal Fee Survey prepared by the Assoc. of Metropolitan Municipalities. He stated Fridley would not be out of line in charging $1,000 for a weekend. Mr. Kirk stated that in the Municipal Fee Survey, there were not many communities that charge a different fee for non-profit organizations. He stated he and Dr. Boudreau felt there was a lot of difference between the two. The non-profit organizations, such as the Hockey Bonster Club and the Jaycees, are service organizations who will put some of the money earned from a tournament back into the community. He stated it definitely costs the City to put on a tournament, and the City should at least cover all its costs. Dr. Boudreau stated tournaments would be scheduled on a first-come, first- served basis. However, right now they do owe allegiance to the Jaycees, Fire Dept., Hockey Booster Club, FYSA, and Fridley Covenant Church. Dr. Boudreau stated the Fridley 49'ers are requesting the tournament, but they will probably not be running the tournament. They are looking at the Hockey Booster Club running the tournament. � � r � � PARKS & RECREATION COMMISSION MEETING, SEPTEMBER 26, 1983 PAGE 7 Dr. Boudreau suggested that someone from the Commission volunteer to discuss this with he and Mr. Kirk in order to draft up a policy on softball field use and concessions. They could then come back to the next Comnission meeting with recommendations. Mr. Allen volunteered to meet with flr.6oudreau and Mr. Kirk. b. Policy - Ice Location - Dick Young Mr. Young stated he for ice locations. meetin�. has not yet completed a drafted policy on rationale He stated he hoped to have it done for the next c. Policy - Nature Center Fees Dr. Boudreau stated the Comnission members had a copy of the Springbrook Nature Center Foundation's recommendations on a fee policy for programming at the Nature Center. The Commission also had a copy of a memo from Siah St. Clair to Dr. Boudreau dated Aug. 17, 1983, concerning the Nature Center Fee Policy. He stated that, if the Commission members remerr�ered, this item has been hanging for over a year when Mr. St. Clatr came before the Commission in June 1982. At that time, the Commission had discussed that maybe there ought to be a charge for outside school groups that come into the Nature Center that make more demands on the Naturalist's time. The Commission.had made a recommendation to the City Council,but the City Council had sent it back wanting to know what the Springbrook Nature Center Foundation's recommendations would be. Dr. Boudreau stated the Commission now has the Foundation;s recommenda- tions and should again make a recommendation to the City Council based on the recommendations made by the Fo�ndation. He stated the Foundation has made four recorr�nendations. The discussion was included along with facts and considerations, concluding that no charge in fee structure was needed at this time. He stated the fee structure as it exists at this time is a charge for day camp programs or a minimal charge for the pro- gramning on an organized basis. The recommendation from Mr. St. Clair was that there should not be a separate fee for prograrr�ning to non-Fridley groups or private groups. Ms. Hughes stated the Foundation is not saying they should never charge fees, but they are saying that at some time in the future they ought to talk with the school districts and try to work something out. They see Mr. St. Clair and his staff at almost the place where they ean start developing some environmental education programming. When they do that, they are going to have a super facility and a very good curriculum so that the schools will want to use it on a more regular basis and then there will be more demands for more staff. At that time, there should be some arrange- ments made between city and schools to look at it and how they eould pro- vide that kind of service. In other words, what they are saying is that when it becomes a big enough problem, they can get other people to share the cos t. i PARKS & RECREATION COMMISSION MEETING, SEPTEMBER 26, 1983 PAGE 8 �` Ms. Hughes stated that while the Foundation did discuss this with Mr. St. Clair, he did make his own decision on this. MOTION BY 1NE. YOUNG, SECONDED BY MS. SEEGER, TO RECEIVE TNE MEMO FROM MR. ST. CLAIR DATED AUG. 17, 1983, AND THE ME1N0 FROM SPRINGBROOK NAfiURE CENTER FOUNDATION DATED AUG. 16, 1983. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE� CHAIRPERSON KONDRICK DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. MOTION BY MR. YOUNG, SECONDED BY MS. SEEGER, TO CONCUR WITH THE RECOMMENDATIONS !�lADE BY THE SPRINGBROOK NATURE CEATER FOUNDATION FEES POLICY FOR PROGRAMS (MEMO DATED AUG. 16� I983 TO SIAX ST. CLAIR)� THAT: I. TXE CITY CONTINUE TO UNDERWRITE NATURE CENTER PROGRAMMING WI TH TAX FUNAS . 2. THE CITY CONTINUE TO CHARGE FOR MATERIALS AND PROGRAMS AS IS CURRENTLY BEING DONE AND IS CONSISTENT WITH WXAT THE CITY ALREADY DOES WITH OTHER RECREATIONAL PROGRAMS AND WHERE THE CLIENT HAS A CHOICE ABOUT SIGNING UP OR NOT. 3. THE CITY CONTINUE TO PROVIDE SERVICES TD GROUPS (I.E. SCOUTS, BROWNIES� CIVIC ORGANIZATIDNS, NURSERY SCHOOLS, ETC.) AS THE NATURE CENTER STAFF HAS TIME AT NO COST AND IN CONSIDERATION OF TNE TAXES BEING PAID AND AS PART OF THE G`OMMUNITY SERVICE/ PUBLIC RELATIONS OF THE DEPARTMENT. SUCH SERVICES ARE UNDER- STOOD TO BE GIVEN AS TIME IS AVAILABLE AND WITH LOCAL GROUPS BEING GIVEN FIRST CHOICE FOR SCHEDULING. 4. THE CITY ENTER INTO NEGOTIATIONS AT AN APPROPRIATE TIME WITH SCHOOL DISTRICTS Z'a PROVIDE ENVIRONMENTAL EDUCATIDN FOR STUDENTS FOR APPROPRIATE FEES WKICX WOULD ALLOW EXPANSION OF STAFF AND PROGRAMMING AND UNDERWRITE ASSOCIATED COSTS. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE� CHAIRPERSON KONDRICK DECLARED THE MOTION CARRIED UNANIMOUSLY. ADJOURNMENT: MOTION BY 1►!R. ALLEN, SECONDED BY 1�LS. SEEGER, TO ADJOURN THE MEETING. UPON A VOICE VOTE, ALL VOTING AYE, CXAIRPERSON KONDRICK DECLARED THE SEPT. 26� 1983� PARKS & RECREATION COMIHISSION MEETING ADJOURNED AT 9:45 P.1N. Respectfully su mitted, Lyn e Saba Recording Secretary �