05/27/1964 - 00022741d kJ o
SPECIAL COiJNCIL MEETIZ�TG - MAY 27� i964 - 8:0o P.M.
A Special Meeting of the Council of the City of Fridley was called
to order by Mayor Nee at 8:20 P.M.
ROLL CALL:
Members Present: Nee, Johanson� Kirkham, Sher3dan� Wright
Members Absent: None
CDNSIDERATION OF 697'H AVENUE NORTf�AST PAVING - HOLIDAY HILIS:
'
Mayor Nee announced the consideration of 69th Avenue Northeast
in Holiday Hi11s for paving and inquired if Mr. Mike Hafner,
developer� wished the City to agree to pay for one-half of the paving
or abandon the statcas of this be3ng a State Aid road. Mr. $afner
replied that all he wanted to do was put in a road as all the work
was done to the roads in the area except the blacktop� but they
had been told the matter had to be brought before the Council before
they could complete the work. The City Manager explaine�a to the
Crty Council it was just a case of the first two blocks into the
Holiday Hille development which had been designated as State Aid, �
so the City Council had to pass on the road. It was further
explained the Planning Commission and Park Committee had met
and now say it shoL�7_d not be a State Aid road and Mr. Hafner could
go ahead and put in the stxeet, that they had felt it wotald be
wise to go across, for a street, by the Minnesota Transfer Company.
Councilman Johanson stated his idea of State Aid Funds is a cross
town road, and the ent3re community should benefit from it. The
City Manager xeplied there would be no State Aid money for construction
unless they designated a certain number of miles as State Aid roads.
Mayor Nee asserted the thoughty at present, was to abandon that part
of the road as a State Aid road. The City Manager replied the whole
question was if this first part of 69th Avenue should be held for
State Aid and the Planning Coimnission felt they would reco�end
no State Aid road through Locke Park. Mr. Hafner stated the reason
they had put the street in by the park on the other side oi IIniversity
was'that they had houses in there and patd Eor the street on both
sides because of the houses but the question here had come up oi
who would pay in Holiday Hills beca�ase there was a park on one
side and he was not certain if he was right af the city could pay
for a street or should pay for one. Mayor Nee replied if he asked
the City Council to be the other 50� petitioner on this� he didn't
think they would petition it. Councilman Johanson inquired if
anyone remembered what Ernie Ma.dsen, former co-developer of the area,
had in mind for the area, that he remembered he had stated he would �
pay for and put in concrete curb and gutter 3n the streets. The
City Manager replied nothing had ever been changed, only the width
of the street and he had indicated it would be paid by the developer.
Councilman Johanson asserted ii the park were ever to get any use
out of thi: rbad� the City should psy for their share of it� that,
originslly� the City was going to use this as an entry and now if
they were going to come into the park someplace else and the park
would never use it, it was questionable how they could expend city
funds. Mr. Hafner repl3ed if this were true� he would abide by it.
�" �_
Councilman Johanson stated that he remembered on another occasion
Mr. Madsen had put in the streets with curb and gutter on the pro-
posal that ii the lots across were developeda they would pay their
share; that the lots had been developed and th owners had not paid
their shsre. Mr. Hafner stated they had also put in a sewer line
for a park connection and they wouldn't have put it in unlees
someone had told them to do so, that they wouldn't have run tihis
line in without stakes which had been placed by someone and somebody
� had some idea of using this for park purposes. Councilman Wright
replied that would be consistent with some idea for use of water
and sewer services in the park. NLr. Hafner restated that if any
Council member remembered, the deal with Mr, Madsen was that he
had said he would put in the streets with concrete curb and gutter�
he would do so. Couneilman Johanson replied if the city were
going to use part of the road, they should bear a part of the cost.
Councilman Wright stated Mr. Hafner shouldn't have to build as
big or as wide a road if it were not a State Aid road and it could
just be a 50 foot road. Mr. Hafner replied the base was laid and
it would be put in accordingly. City Engineer Qureshi explained
if the developer used the same specifications they now have� their
road would be better than the average street in Fridley as they
have a six inch base. Mr. Hafner stated he had thought to get all
the plans together and have all matters clear before they went
ahead. Councilman Wright asserted Mr. Hafner should get a break
on what kind of a road it should be as it will get no amount of
public use.
Mr. Dick Donlin of the Park Co�ittee was present and inquired
what would happen if the street in question became a park access.
The City Manager replied they would have to reimburse the developer.
Mr. Donlin stated their recommendation to the Planning Commission
was that their thought now Was to have a dead end and logically,
then 69th Avenue becomes the entrance and they were not interested
� in a through road. The City Manager indicated the Planning Co�ission
had reco�ended that they didn't feel the road would need to be
widened and if it should become the access, it would have to be
w3dened and the developer would be reimbursed. Mr. Hafner stated
the street should have been planned so that it would have houses
on both sides of the street� that this was the way it was originally
planned. The City Manager replied he had never seen the plat come
in any way but the present way. Mr. TIafner stated the present
owner of the area� Mr. Charles Johanson, had stated that at least in
part of the street� it should be made a little wider. The City
Manager replied the Planning Commission had stated in case there
should be a need� they would have to widen it and pay the cost of
widening it� meanwhile the area would have a street.
Mr. Hafner inquired of the City Council if there would be any objection
then to putting in the concrete curb only on one side of the street,
Councilman Johanson replied he felt that would be good and further
felt the City Council should have a writiten agreement for Mr. Hafner"s
protection that the City would pick up the other side of the street.
The City Manager stated if the City decided to widen the street,
it would belong to the City regardless and the City would have to
pay for it. Mr. Hafner asserted the street would have no curb on
one side at all if this was satisiactory� that this was all he was
trying to make understood. Mayor Nee inquirer3 why a curb was put
onJ that his impression was that it was to keep the street from
� collapsing, Mr. Hafner stated that al�. the areas he had developed
in Fridley were the best such as Holida,y Hills, Brookview, and
Melody Ma.nor for some and they had used the best material and had
never developed any land without curbs. Mayor Nee stated it was
his opinion that it would be better to have blacktop curb on both
sides of the street rather than concrete curb only on one slde,
bvt there were at least half a dozen builders and people coming in
and wanting to resolve problems oi this kind and the decision had
���
always been in favor oi the persan who doesn't want to go ahead
because the City Council had never felt the needs oY the builder
should get precedence. Mr. Hafner replied he had always felt any
improvement should benefit the city as a whole and his developments
hafl, that he had also wanted 73rd Avenue run all the way through
but it wasn't.
Councilman Johanson �nquired of Mr. Hafner that supposing he were
to go ahead and put in the 50 foot street, would he do so if there �
were a written agreement that if the day were ever to come that the
City� through its park� uses 69th Avenue� that he would want his
company reimbursed. Mr. Aainer replied the money should be put
in eserow and they should treat themselves in the same roanner thqr
treated him as he had to put money in escrow on aZl developments.
Couneilman Johanson stated that he felt the City was obligated to
tbis area ior curb and gutter on the North side of the street.
Mr. Hafner asserted the dec3sion was Por tne Council to make� that
al1 he wished was that the matter be done right. Councilman Wright
stated if they should decide they wanted an exit on the atreet,
then they would have to eut through the asphalt and stated he would
like to see Mr. Hafner do his side of the street only and ask only
that the other side be temporary. Mr, Hafner replied Mr. Dunkley
was doing the streets the same as the city had the previaus year
and using the same speciiications.
Mayor Nee asserted it seemed to him all Mr. Hafner needed was for
the City to abandon their interest in the State Aid road and advise
City Engineer Qureshi to not bloek Mr, Hafner"s plan� thaty in
effect, this does abandon the State Aid mileage and it was logieally
correct in every respect except the North half oi the street
doesn't want the street. The City Manager explained there should
be a motion authorizing Mr. Hafner to put in a standard construction
road to city specifications. Mr. Hafner stated the city specifications
did not require him to put in cvrb on two sides o£ the 5treet. The �
City Manager told Mr. Hafner he wasn`t losing any lots by putting
in the road and he wasn't putting in any more road then he would
have put in by putting in curb on both sides. Mayor Nee inquired
if Mr. Hafner wished to purchase a str3ng of lots on the North
side of the street. Mr. Hafner replied he might be. Councilman
Sheridan asserted they were not able to sell the land. Mayor Nee
indicated the Charter �rovided a way of selling park land. A
discussion per�.od was held regarding the area� its size, use� etc.
Councilman Wright asserted it would be 135 feet deep. City Attorney
Smith indicated the money could be put into the Park Fund. Mr. Bob
Hughes of the Park Committee stated they did plan to use the space
in question and inquared how far it was to the Minnesota Transfer
and was told a6out �+00 feet. Mayor Nee im�uired how i$ would be
if they didn't stop Mr, Hafner from putting in his street and refer
the problem to the Park Board Committee. The City Managex explained
to the City Council the deed to the property had the wards "for a
park and for its public purposes". A discussion was held regarding
sewer and water development in the area to the park. Nlayor Nee
stated it seemed reasonable to him to have Mr. Hainer put in a
regular street according to apecifications and the City give him
an agreement that when they use the street they would pay for their
share. Counc3lman Johanson further stated that in the event the
Park Coumiittee someday decides on a street, than they should have
to pay a proportionate share. The City Manager asserted the manner
the Park Committee is now considering, they want a par�ing lot at �
each end of the park with walking in from there.
Cnuncilman Johanson replied 3f the city authoxized curb on the North
side of the street, they should pay for it. Councilman Sheridan
stated, that assuming the City didn't own a part of this area,
would any person have 13ability to the development ior the street.
.�
� � s__
Councilman Wright replied the City di�!t�petition and were not developing.
Councilman Sheridan stated if this pl ��6`�t the ad�oining property
to the North and it is an outlet of 6 inches or a foot, at such time
as the abutting property wants access for that 6 inches or a foot, it
would cost the owner on the North half the cost of the street, Mr.
Hafner replied that would be a way of doing i� but he did not approve
of doing the street in that way. Councilman Sheridan asserted he did
not know how this plat was laid out but, presumably, ?t had no boulevard.
� Mr. Hafner explained if the City was �oing to use th�s for a pa.rk
entrance� they would have come to any property owner alongside and they
woulfl have said the property owner would have to pay their share of
the road. Mayor Nee replied they had city streets all over the city
that needed paving and they were not doing them because they had no
money and inquired how they could permit a developer to say they had
to do it. Councilman Johanson inquired of Mayor Nee what streets he
was referring to. Mayor Nee repl3ed 61st Street was an example� that
all he was saying was if this were goi,ng to be put on a general tax
levy, he would na� vote fpr it. He further stated he did not feel they
eould permit the needs of the developer to determine how they could
delegate money ?or paving.
Mr. Hafner replied it had. never been meant to be that way. Mayor Nee
asserted that assuming� for e moment� he accepted the liability� that
all he could say was he could not a.ecept it and the city would not
put in the street for ten years.
Mr. Hafner inquired� if this were correctf if Mayor Nee thought they
shouldn't put in the street. Mayor Nee stated if the City had to
pay for it out of general funds, he would say not to put it in, that
he did not know how they could pay £or it even though he wished to
see it put in, Mayor Nee stated the question now was whether or not
the City wants to pave the street and he did not want to see the City
pave it out of general teac funds, The City Manager explained they were
� now down to just the curb and gutter on the North s3de of the street.
Mr. Hafner stated he would ask Mr. Johansan, and perhaps he won't
want a street there at all. City Attorney Smith inquired if it were
possible if the curb were left off of the North side, if there would
be some way of rolling 'the earth on the North side to protect the
paving. City Engineer Q�reshi replied he hadn't looked at thegzvund
but would like to see the curb there as it does protect the inner
pavement. City Attorney Smith then inquired if a rolled asphalt curb
on that side wovld be satisfactory with cement curb on the other side.
Cfty Engineer Qureshi rep].ied it was a matter of tiMe and what the
City Council wanted. Mr. Hafner stated they could lay the blacktop
bare and bulldoze dirt but it was not the proper way to do it and he
wanted it done properly.
Councilman Sheridan inquired re�arding the length o£ the street to
get an approximate idea o£ the cost of curb and gutter. Councilman
Wright replied it figured out to about $3,000.00 for aoncrete curb and
gutter on one side. Councilman Sohanson stated it was about 1200
feet. Mr. Hafner asserted the City would be getting a good deal on
this as a11 the plannin� and drawing and all other work is done. The
City Manager stated they were not �etting any free engineering as
the developer always pays for that. Mr. Hafner replied there were
always engineer's fees in all matters taken up and this was inoluded.
Mayor Nee stated if the City had to pay $3�000.00 out of this budget�
he conld not �ustify it to the people they were getting their value
� and their use out of it, that he did agree that sometime in the future
the City would use it.
Mayor Nee inqu3red if it was satisfactory to Mr. Hafner to give him
an acknowledgment oi their liability in writing that if ior some
reason they use 69th Avenue for access to the park� the City would
pay its share and he could put in the street. City Attorney Smith
suggested to the City Council that eyen though they would put the
� `�'
d �r
agreement in writing� a letter should be incorporated in the minutes.
It was indicated by Mayor Nee to the City Council they would needto
clear th3s matter in two motions� one to authorize the standard
¢onstruction of the stxeet rather than what was provided on State
Aid Specifications.
Motion by Wright to authorize the construction of Holiday $ills� 69th
Avenue Northeast according to City standards rather than to State
Aid standards. Seconded by Johanson. Councilman Kirkham inquired
if this was auihorized according to the final plat. It was stated �
this was, Upon a voice vote, there being no nays� the motion carried
unanimously.
Mayor Nee indicate@ a motion would be in order in which the City Council
agrees to accept respons3bility for some pvrtion oi' the street. Councilman
Sheridan inqu3red what the purpose was. Mayor Nee replied it was jUSt
to assure whoever might be the owner oY the plat that if the City does
start to use the street in question for the general public purpose�
at that time the City yiould accept responsibility. The City Mana�er
suggested they make clear what portion of the road they referred to
and the amount oP feet. Councilman Johanson replied it should be
their proportionate share to be decided on. Councilman Wright agreed
it should be left flexi7ale.
Motaon by Wright that the City Manager i�e directed to noti£y the
Charlea E. Johanson, Inc., that when and iP the City makes use of
69th Avernze Northeast as an access road in part or in whole for
Locke Park� that it will reimburse the Chaxles E. Johanson, Inc. for
some prqportionate share of the cost of installing ¢oncrete curh and
gutter on the North side oi seid 6jth Avenue Northeast; that the cost
shall be determined on the basis of actual construction cost at the
time of construction and the portion Qr length of the stree� attributable
to the city's use will be determined by the Ci�y counc3l. Seconded
by Sheridan. Upon a voice vote� the motion carried with couneilman
Johanson abstaining. �
CONSIDERATION dF BEACH HOUSE:
Mayor Nee announced for Council consideration the proposed Beach House
on Moore Lake. The City Manager explained to the City Council the
recommendation of the Planning Commissaon was that they recommend the
authorization of the Moore Lake Beach House and recommend that eonstruction
rather than the purchase of land. Councilman Johanson inquired if it
was planned to have a custodian on duty at all times. Mr. Bob Hughes�
of the Park Boardy stated there would be at all times the Beach House was
open. Councilman Johanson suggested the Beach House be built as fool
praof as was possible,
Mayor Nee asserted it had been his opinion they had asked for a regort
on how the balance of the money for parks was to be spent end had seen
nothing in writing. He further asserted they should consider the land
on Locke Lake and any other lots red-tagged� that� at least� the
assumption that there is some other plann3ng resume the Park Board has
talked abaut spending. It was stated these should all be brought
together and a report made. Mr. Hughes replied the discussion had
been that there is a small piece of land ad,7acent to another small piece
and the combination of the two can offer at best a very small neighborhood
park with access to the lake for swimming and boats that can be carried.
He further stated the bank o�' the land which they own is steep and about ,
half o� the other piece is also quite steep, that the development that
could be given the area would be a small shaded area with picnic tables
and would offer a view of the lake. Mr. Hughes asserted the ieeling
of his committee was that they had in the city a number of parks in
which they had ma�or investments, Locke Park and Moore Lake Beach and
the largest number of residents can best be served by these, It was
ment3oned that Moore Lake Beach will be completed within a short time and
will benefit a large number of people in the City and will give Fridley
a land mark. Mr. Hughes stated they had dressed up the Fark and the
beach front is rather good but the tin house or the beach iront is going
to look more and more ont of place as time goes by, that they offer nothing
in the way of dressing rooms and toilet fact].ities. He further stated
they had forbidden the changing of clothes in cars for sWimmers and the
� addition of the new heach house would provide all of the things the,y
were missing and would provide a decent place for the beach staff and a
good first aid space and, in general, would give them a facility that
would be very useful �nd benefit a large number of people. It was
mentioned +he Beach House had been designed to use as a warming house
for tixe winter and t'tiey have tried to work into zt a �*enera7 purpose
park building� a craft housea etc.� in the evaiit that the lake becomes
Rnfit for swimming, that their efforts �n the direetion of getting
iniormation from the Conservation Department had not been saceessful
rega,rding the fact the lake may disappear.
Councsltnan Johanson inquired if the City had not bought ,7ust about enough
land for awhile. Mayor Nee replied this was the question the Park Committee
had evaded. Mr. Hughes stated he didn't ieel they were evading an answer�
that they had said they wanted to pick up two lots at Broad and Hugo
Streets and this would cost� plus assessments� about $1500.00. He further
stated they would like to buy five lots adjacent to the r3ver front pro-
perty about 79th and Alden or Apex Lane a1so, those being Lots 20 through
25� Block b� Riverview Terrace and the price of these lots including taxes
and assessments would approximately he $3�000.00. Mr. Hughes asserted
a total of about $4,500.00 was the amount they had in mind for land
at this time and they had also put a red tag on the edge of Spring Lake
but there would be very little likelihood the3r would purchase that.
It was mentioned the Park Committee had talked about the lot on I.ocke
Lake but did not think it was red tagged. Mayor Nee replied there are
� people in the area that will be isolated from service to any park and tl�
would like the City to pick up these lots on the railroad tracks and
all he wanted to see was some kind of inethodical plan. Tt was stated
by Mayor Nee he did not want to spend the money on the Beach House and
raise the general bvdget for speczal assessments� that he wanted to
be sure before they went into anything e1se. Councilman .Tohanson
stated he felt they had so many parcels of land they would be getting
land poor. Mr. Hughes explained they had a number of parcels of land
which are too small for the use they were designed and in order to ex-
pan3 some 7�,=�rks� they would have to condemn homes; also� there were
sections where there is no open land in the vicinity, Mr. Hughes stated
he couldn't say they didn't need and won"t want additional land for
parks but they don"t have a desire, at tY�is poir.t, to acquire land
other than what the had oUtlined, that the amount of money remaining
£or their use in the Park Deposit Fund was down to the point where
they couldn't go out and look for a ma,7or tract of land.
Councilman Johanson stated he was in favor of the Beach House. The
City Manager explained Mr. Glenn Thompson of the Board had stressed they
have major parks and the feeling of the Park Committee was that it was
time tp finish the development of these so that the people can use them
now and if they want to buy more park property they can budget as time
goes by.
Motion by Johanson to adopt iiESOLUTION �108-1964 authorizing the
� construction of a Beach House on Moore Lake and the advertising for
bids. Seconded by Kirkham. Upon a voice vote� there being no nays� the
motion carried unanimously.
ADJOURN:
There being no further business� Mayor Nee declared the Spec�al Couneil
Meeting of May 27, 1964 adjourned.
R> Fir
�d �€�
?��
Respectfully submitted�
,� ���.,�
���1,/V�'�Q''�''� `. �,,��
Sue Miskowi William J. Ne '
Secretary to the Gouneil Mayor
REGULAR COUNCIL MEETING - JUNE 2� 1964
A regFalar meeting of the Council of the City of Fridley was called �
to arder by Mayor Pdee at 8:07 P.M.
ROLL CALL:
Members Present: Neey Johanson, Sheridan, Wright� Kirkham arrived
at 10:15 P.M„
Members Absent,: Nbne
APPROVAL OF MINUTES - REGULAR MEETIlVG� MAY 18, i964:
Motion by Sohanson to approve the minutes of the Regular Meeting oi
May 1�3, 196� as prepared a�d received. Seconded by Sheridan. QLpon
a voice vote, there being no nays� the moi,ion carried unanimously.
APPROVAL OF MINUTES - SPECIAL MEETING, MAY 27, 1964:
Motion b�r Sheridan to approve the minutes of the Special Meetang of
May 27y 1964 as prepared and rece3ved. Seconded hy Wright. Upon a
voice vote, there being no nays� the motion cerried unanimously.
PUBI,IC HEARINGS:
PUBLIC HEARING ON ASSESSMENT - ST. 1962-1, 1962-2:
Mayor Nee announced a public hearing on assessments for Street
Improvement Pro,7ects No. 1962-1 and i962-2 and stated it migpt
serve the parpose of the hearings to have the City Manager explaip_
�